Search for content in message boards

Clifford family Armagh

Replies: 5

Re: Clifford family Armagh

Posted: 31 Mar 2013 7:15AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hello Camlad,

From reading the various replies concerning your Clifford and Furpy ancestors, I notice that you now have information about several children born to Richardson Joseph Clifford and Mary Furphy. Concerning this family, I uncovered the birth and baptism indexes for at least 10 of their children at the Irish Family History Foundation (IFHF) website for County Armagh. The births of the children were all recorded in the Lurgan No. 2 (CP), that is, Civil Parish. These are civil birth records as opposed to baptisms. I also found the baptism indexes for 7 of the 10 children. All the baptisms were recorded in the Seagoe Catholic Church in County Armagh.

The names and dates of the births or baptisms of these children are: Joseph (1887); Theresa/Teresa (1889); Catherine (1891); James (1893); Margaret (1895); John (1897); James (1898); Letty 1901; Francis (1902); and Edward (1905).

Most of the first names of the Clifford children I had found in the 1901 census, which shows the family residing in Derryadd, District Electoral Division (DED) of Montiaghs, County Armagh.

The first two birth and baptism indexes you see below are for Joseph. The IFHF search engine accepted Richardson as his father’s first name in both indexes. But for children born after Joseph, the search would only accept the first name of Richardson in the Seagoe Catholic Church baptisms, but not in the Lurgan civil births. For the civil births, the search engine would only accept the father’s name as Richard. This is how the births and baptisms are most likely recorded in copies of the originals. You’ll also notice in the indexes that follow that the child’s name in the 1889 birth index is spelled Theresa, while her name in the accompanying baptism index is spelled Teresa. If you try to access the birth and baptism indexes for this child without spelling her name as noted in the indexes, the search engine will not produce any results.

The IFHF homepage can be found at: http://www.rootsireland.ie/

Before accessing indexes at the IFHF you’ll first have to register. Registration is free. You’ll also be able to access the birth and baptism indexes for the Clifford children that I did for free, but you will be charged to obtain transcriptions of the births and baptisms from the IFHF. You’ll have to purchase credits with a credit card to obtain the transcriptions. The IFHF website has more information about purchasing credits for baptism, as well as birth, marriage, and death or burial transcriptions at: http://www.rootsireland.ie/index.php?id=78

The birth and baptism indexes (16 indexes in all) for the 10 Clifford children are below:


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Joseph 1887 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Joseph
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1887

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Joseph 1887 Parish: SEAGOE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Joseph
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1887

Parish/District: SEAGOE (RC)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Theresa 1889 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Theresa
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1889

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Teresa 1889 Parish: SEAGOE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Teresa
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1889

Parish/District: SEAGOE (RC)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Catherine 1891 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Catherine
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1891

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Catherine 1891 Parish: SEAGOE (RC)


Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Catherine
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1891

Parish/District: SEAGOE (RC)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) James 1893 Parish: SEAGOE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: James
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1893

Parish/District: SEAGOE (RC)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Margaret 1895 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Margaret
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1895

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Margaret 1895 Parish: SEAGOE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Margaret
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1895

Parish/District: SEAGOE (RC)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) John 1897 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: John
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1897

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) John 1897 Parish: SEAGOE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: John
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1897

Parish/District: SEAGOE (RC)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) James 1898 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: James
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1898

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) James 1898 Parish: SEAGOE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: James
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1898

Parish/District: SEAGOE (RC)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Letty 1901 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Letty
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1901

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Francis 1902 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Francis
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1902

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)
____


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Edward 1905 Parish: LURGAN NO2 (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Edward
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year: 1905

Parish/District: LURGAN NO2 (CP)
____


Concerning the birth indexes for Francis and Edward, born in 1902 and 1905 respectively, I had to guess as to what their first names were, as the IFHF does not provide names in any of their records, unless you know what they are, or take a guess as to what they are. The other option would have been to expend credits to find out what their first names were, but I didn’t want to do that.

You can order the birth and baptism transcriptions for the Clifford children individually from the 10 different indexes, or you can order them from one index. To order the transcriptions form one index, do not include the first names of the children in the search engine. In place of the first names use the % sign as a wild card. Also, do not use the full first name of the father, Richardson, but use Richard as the civil births were not recorded (according to the indexes above) under the first name of Richardson, except for the birth of Joseph. Also do not include the years of births or baptisms, or the district or parish where the births or baptisms took place. The search engine form will look like this:


16 matches for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) %

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: %
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richard
Mother's Surname: Furphy
Mother's First Name: Mary

Year:

Parish/District:
____


I then found both the 1886 church and civil parish marriage indexes for Joseph Clifford and Mary Furphy at the IFHF website for County Armagh. The church index shows they were married in the Drumcree Catholic Church. The civil index shows their marriage recorded in the Portadown district civil parish (CP):


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Joseph 1886 Parish: DRUMCREE (RC)

Record Type: Marriage Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Joseph
Spouse's Surname: Furphy
Spouse's First Name: Mary
Father's Surname:
Father's First Name:
Mother's Surname:
Mother's First Name:

Year: 1886

Parish/District: Parish: DRUMCREE (RC)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Joseph 1886 Parish: PORTADOWN RC (CP)

Record Type: Marriage Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Joseph
Spouse's Surname: Furphy
Spouse's First Name: Mary
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name:
Mother's Surname:
Mother's First Name:

Year: 1886

Parish/District: Parish: PORTADOWN RC (CP)
____


Civil marriages from this time period traditionally include the names of the fathers of the groom and bride, but not the names of their mothers. For Joseph’s father I submitted to the search engine the first name of Richardson, which the search engine accepted:


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Joseph 1886 Parish: PORTADOWN RC (CP)

Record Type: Marriage Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Joseph
Spouse's Surname: Furphy
Spouse's First Name: Mary
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Richardson
Mother's Surname:
Mother's First Name:

Year: 1886

Parish/District: Parish: PORTADOWN RC (CP)
____


In a reply to one of your posts at Ancestry.com pertaining to Mary Furphy, EileenWilson001 had kindly submitted a birth index (from Ancestry.com) for Mary Furfey, showing that her parents were John Furfey and Susannah McMahon.

But, with Mary Furphy as the primary partner in the IFHF marriage index, I submitted John as the name of Mary’s father to the search engine, but the search engine rejected this name. Instead, after a few guesses the search engine did accept Joseph as the first name of Mary’s father in the 1886 marriage index for Portadown:


1 match for the search criteria: Furphy (plus variants) Mary 1886 Parish: PORTADOWN RC (CP)

Record Type: Marriage Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Furphy
First Name: Mary
Spouse's Surname: Clifford
Spouse's First Name: Joseph
Father's Surname: Furphy
Father's First Name: Joseph
Mother's Surname:
Mother's First Name:

Year: 1886

Parish/District: Parish: PORTADOWN RC (CP)
____


You would have to order the transcription of the civil marriage for Joseph Clifford and Mary Furphy to conform that Mary’s father’s first name was Joseph, rather than John, as records from the IFHF are transcriptions of originals, not copies of the originals, which means they are subject to error.

In the 1901 census Mary Clifford is shown to be 33 years old, which places her year of birth circa 1868, three years after the 1865 birth index submitted by EileenWilson001, where Mary’s father is listed as John Furfey and her mother as Susanna McMahon.

Just to confirm this birth with another source, I looked for Mary’s birth as well as baptism indexes at the IFHF website for County Armagh and located both indexes.

The first index below shows that Mary’s civil birth was recorded in the Tartaraghan in 1865. The second index shows that Mary’s baptism took place in the Drumcree Catholic Church in 1865. In both indexes the IFHF search engine accepted John as the first name of Mary’s father. In the birth index the search engine accepted the spelling of Susanna for her mother’s first name, but Susana as the spelling of her mother’s first name in the baptism index. The search engine accepted McMahon as the mother’s maiden name in both the birth and baptism indexes:


1 match for the search criteria: Furphy (plus variants) Mary 1865 Parish: TARTARAGHAN CP (CP)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Furphy
First Name: Mary
Father's Surname: Furphy
Father's First Name: John
Mother's Surname: McMahon
Mother's First Name: Susanna

Year: 1865

Parish/District: TARTARAGHAN CP (CP)


AND


1 match for the search criteria: Furphy (plus variants) Mary 1865 Parish: DRUMCREE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Furphy
First Name: Mary
Father's Surname: Furphy
Father's First Name: John
Mother's Surname: McMahon
Mother's First Name: Susana

Year: 1865

Parish/District: DRUMCREE (RC)
____


I then wanted to see if I could uncover a birth or baptism index in the 1860s for a Mary Furphy whose father was Joseph. I found one index. This is for a Mary Murphy who was baptized in the Drumcree Catholic Church in 1863. The IFHF search engine accepted Margaret as the first name of her mother after some guess work as to what her first name was:


1 match for the search criteria: Furphy (plus variants) Mary 1863 Parish: DRUMCREE (RC)

Record Type: Baptism/Birth Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Furphy
First Name: Mary
Father's Surname: Furphy
Father's First Name: Joseph
Mother's Surname:
Mother's First Name: Margaret

Year: 1863

Parish/District: DRUMCREE (RC)
____


I didn’t try to guess what Margaret’s maiden name was. You would have to order the baptism transcription from the IFHF to find out what her maiden name was.

I then looked for the birth or baptism index for a Richardson Clifford, but didn’t find one in the 1860s. Nor did I find the baptism index for a Richardson Clifford in the 1850s. But I did uncover an 1853 marriage index for a Richardson Clifford and others at Ancestry.com, but this index shows the names of three brides, anyone of which Richardson could have married. The index doesn’t specify which two people married:

Ireland, Civil Registration Marriages Index, 1845-1958

Name: Richardson Clifford
Date of Registration: 1853
Registration district: Lurgan
Volume: 7
Page Number: 547
FHL Film Number: 101244

Records on Page:

Name

Thomas Magee
Mary Jane Johnston
Thomas Telford
Sarah Irwin
Richardson Clifford
Ann Toal
George Procter

Source Information:
Ancestry.com. Ireland, Civil Registration Marriages Index, 1845-1958 [database on-line]. Provo, UT, USA: Ancestry.com Operations, Inc., 2011.

Original data:
“Ireland, Civil Registration Indexes 1845–1958,” Index. FamilySearch, Salt Lake City, Utah. General Register Office. "Quarterly Returns of Births in Ireland with Index to Births." Belfast, Ireland.
____


At this point I went back to the IFHF website for County Armagh to see if Richardson Clifford had married Mary Jane Johnston, Sarah Irwin, or Ann Toal in 1853. The search engine accepted Ann Toal as Richardson’s wife. However, the index shows the couple were married in the Tartaraghan (CI), that is Church of Ireland, rather than in the Catholic Church. I took a few guesses as to the name of Richardson’s father and the search engine accepted Robert:


1 match for the search criteria: Clifford (plus variants) Richardson 1853 Parish: TARTARAGHAN CI (CP)

Record Type: Marriage Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Clifford
First Name: Richardson
Spouse's Surname: Toal
Spouse's First Name: Ann
Father's Surname: Clifford
Father's First Name: Robert
Mother's Surname:
Mother's First Name:

Year: 1853

Parish/District: Parish: TARTARAGHAN CI (CP)
____


With Ann Toal as the primary partner in the marriage index, I guessed that her father’s first name was James:


1 match for the search criteria: Toal (plus variants) Ann 1853 Parish: TARTARAGHAN CI (CP)

Record Type: Marriage Records for Co. Armagh
Surname: Toal
First Name: Ann
Spouse's Surname: Clifford
Spouse's First Name: Richardson
Father's Surname: Toal
Father's First Name: James
Mother's Surname:
Mother's First Name:

Year: 1853

Parish/District: Parish: TARTARAGHAN CI (CP)
____


The 1886 church marriage for Joseph Clifford and Mary Furphy had shown they were married in the Portadown Catholic Church. That index had also noted that Joseph’s father was Richardson Clifford. It could be that Richardson Joseph Clifford (the younger) had belonged to the Church of Ireland but had converted to Catholicism in order to marry Mary Furphy in 1886, but that’s only a guess on my part.

Kind Regards,

Dave Boylan
SubjectAuthorDate Posted
Camlad 26 Mar 2013 11:53PM GMT 
DaveBoylan 31 Mar 2013 1:15PM GMT 
Camlad 31 Mar 2013 10:51PM GMT 
DaveBoylan 4 Apr 2013 2:09PM GMT 
Camlad 4 Apr 2013 8:30PM GMT 
DaveBoylan 9 May 2013 12:26PM GMT 
per page

Find a board about a specific topic

  • Visit our other sites:

© 1997-2014 Ancestry.com | Corporate Information | New Privacy | New Terms and Conditions