General - Family History & Genealogy Message Board

Re: Truls Anderson Harbeck d 1741

bohjohan — 2013-05-25 13:01:47Z

Truls Anderson Harbeck dead at the sea expedition the 25th August 1741. In [his] stead the 29th December the same year: Sven Svensson Fagerdahl.

Or perhaps the name was Starbeck?

// Bo Johansson

Re: Sven Svensson and Maria Mansdotter Marriage and Birth records?

bohjohan — 2013-05-25 12:48:38Z

The placename is Öster Mobäcken.

Sven Svensson born 1750 in Åsaka, Maria Månsdotter born 1755 "in Loco" (here, at this place).

Näs was an annex-parish in the Yllestad, Näs, and Vistorp "pastorat". Näs births 1721-1769 and marriages 1727-1798 were recorded in Yllestad CI:2.

There were 5 parishes named Åsaka, the closest probably Vartofta-Åsaka.

Vartofta-Åsaka births 1750 starts at AD Vartofta-Åsaka CI:2 (1706-1753) Image 86 / page 161 (AID: v55622.b86.s161, NAD: SE/GLA/13616).

I don't see any Sven born 1750, but several entries are unreadable, perhaps he was born in the "pastorat" Vartofta-Åsaka and Kälvene, and there could be errors in birth-year and/or birth parish. Or it was a different Åsaka parish...

There is a Maria born 11 May 1755, parents Måns Andersson and Maria Andersdotter of Öst.Mobecken, in AD Yllestad CI:2 (1721-1769) Image 79 / page 151 (AID: v56704.b79.s151, NAD: SE/GLA/13651).

The son born 1784 might not be their first child, I see a Sven and Maria of Öster Mobecken married 5 Feb 1775, his parents Sven Pehrsson and Greta Svensdotter, her parents Måns Andersson and Maria Andersdotter.
AD Yllestad CI:2 (1721-1769) Image 27 / page 47 (AID: v56704.b27.s47, NAD: SE/GLA/13651)

// Bo Johansson

Re: Nystrom-Persson-Staff

JOBaouab — 2013-05-25 03:50:39Z

I looked on a place name cd called "Svenska Ortnamn 1999".

There is a place called Järpen (not Jarpen) in Undersåker parish.

There is a village called Rönnöfors (not Ronnofors) in Offerdal parish.

There is a village called Kallsedet in Kall parish.

Ristafallet is in Undersåker parish.

Judy

Re: Nystrom-Persson-Staff

JOBaouab — 2013-05-25 03:43:01Z

I'm not at all familiar with geography in that area.

However, this map shows the location of Kall parish in the section called ÅRE.

http://www.gis.scb.se/atlas/RikIndAtlas1992/showimg_en.asp?i...

Judy

1823 Divorce Records: Translation Help, Please

mloncaric13 — 2013-05-25 03:32:57Z

Hi --

I am looking for some help in translating -- really, deciphering the handwriting! -- a few pages of a 21 page court record of my ancestors' 1823 divorce in Stockholm. The handwriting is truly a challenge, and I certainly don't expect or ask anyone to translate word for word, but, rather, the gist of the information on these few pages. My own Swedish is limited and when one throws difficult handwriting and creative spelling into the mix, I am confounded.

My primary interest in these documents -- besides learning more about my family and their own personal dramas -- is in finding information about Sven Cantzoff, the wronged husband in this divorce case. The earliest record I can find about him dates about 1800, and yet he was born in 1764/7. We don't know anything about where he came from or what he was doing before then. So, my hope is that these records might hold some basic biographical information about the parties concerned.

The pages I will attach are the final 3 pages of the 21 page document. Again, I very much appreciate any help you can provide, any clues your more practiced eyes can discern. Thank you so much...

Meredith

Re: Nystrom-Persson-Staff

alananystrom — 2013-05-25 03:07:38Z

Thanks for posting this Judy. Do you know where Kall Parish is? Is it near the towns of Kallsedet, Ronnofors, and Jarpen? We found an old family photo of Ristafallet (Rista Falls) which is believe is between Are and Jarpen and I'm thinking that is likely close to where the family homestead was...

Truls Anderson Harbeck d 1741

roconnor199 — 2013-05-25 02:57:00Z

Truls Anderson Harbeck was an infantry soldier in the Kalmar Regiment and died in 1741. Reference is made to his death in 1741 in the General Muster Roll for the Kalmar Regiment (Major's Company) Rote 52 in 1742. The entry (attached) is very short and I wonder if any one could translate it for me.

Many thanks
Robert

Sven Svensson and Maria Mansdotter Marriage and Birth records?

mfettinger1 — 2013-05-25 02:22:01Z

I am looking for the birth and marriage records for Sven Svenson b1750 and Maria Mansdotter b1755 who are shown in the attached 1797-1817 Household Examination Record from Nas page 36 GID 1559.2.6800. It looks like Sven was born in Asaka?, but I can't find a parish by that name. I'm not sure where Maria was born, but if it was Nas, Ancestry's Nas birth records don't start until 1770. Does this mean the birth records don't exist (or Ancestry doesn't have them)? Since their son Sven was born in 1784, they were probably married sometime around 1783. Ancestry's marriage records for Nas start in 1860. Does this mean that no record of their marriage exists? Any help would be much appreciated.

Re: Nilsson

Lundpe — 2013-05-24 23:39:33Z

Here is the information on sister Emelia Augusta

1865 born 13 Dec baptized 13 Dec Emilia Augusta illegitimate mother Nilsdotter, Karin found on page 228 of church book

Hov C:6 (1850-1865) Image 49 / page 93 (AID: v37837.b49.s93, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

church records can be found here

Hov AI:10 (1861-1865) Image 240 / page 228 (AID: v25994.b240.s228, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

Re: Nilsson

Lundpe — 2013-05-24 22:56:07Z

So I found an earlier record of Carin Nilsotter which explains the Henning in Erik's name. It appears to be about daughter Mathilda and reads "Hennes illegitimate daughter p 109." So the father should have been Hannes for the children

Hov AI:9 (1856-1860) Image 179 / page 166 (AID: v25992.b179.s166, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

page 109 is also attached

note Matilda looks like a full sister as the record reads

Hennes illegitimate daughter Matilda 20 Sep 1850 in Hov.

Hov AI:9 (1856-1860) Image 122 / page 109 (AID: v25992.b122.s109, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

Re: Nilsson

Lundpe — 2013-05-24 22:55:37Z

So I found an earlier record of Carin Nilsotter which explains the Henning in Erik's name. It appears to be about daughter Mathilda and reads "Hennes -- Her illegitimate daughter p 109."
Hov AI:9 (1856-1860) Image 179 / page 166 (AID: v25992.b179.s166, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

page 109 is also attached

note Matilda

Her illegitimate daughter Matilda 20 Sep 1850 in Hov.

Hov AI:9 (1856-1860) Image 122 / page 109 (AID: v25992.b122.s109, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

Re: Nystrom-Persson-Staff

alananystrom — 2013-05-24 21:38:48Z

This is what I have:

Per Person, born in 1760 in Unervieken, Ore, Sweden, died 1947. Mrs. Per Person, birth year unknown, died in 1847.

Son - Per Staf (name recorded in Ostersund, Jemtland), later changed name to Peter Nystrom, born Dec 24, 1815 in Kalls Fork, Jemtland, died Oct 26, 1892. He was married in 1838 to Martha Mahlberg, born Feb 9, 1812 and died March 19, 1898.

Hans Nystrom (son, 3rd of 6 children): born 4/6/1846, died 8/26/1934 and married 4/10/1870 to Anna Olson, born 6/7/1843, died 1/1/1916. Hans and his brother Olaf left Jemtland, Sweden on 4/13/1870 landing in Quebec on 5/9 with tickets to Milwaukee. Ended up in MN eventually.

I'm looking for more info on Mr. and Mrs. Per Person and the generations before them. Thanks!

Re: Where do they live?

Harold_Bern — 2013-05-24 21:32:34Z

Thanks Don

Hal Bern

Re: Nystrom-Persson-Staff

JOBaouab — 2013-05-24 20:12:21Z

Alana,

Perhaps those of us who try to help (but who are not related) could help you out if you provided some details on the names you listed. (when and where born, if they emigrated and when they emigrated, and so forth).

Have fun on your trip to Sweden. Do you know specifically where your ancestors lived in Sweden?

http://www.sweden.se/upload/Sweden_se/english/publications/R...

I'll be in Sweden in a couple of weeks.

Judy

Re: Nystrom-Persson-Staff

JOBaouab — 2013-05-24 20:07:36Z

Muriel,

This looks like your family leaving their parish before leaving Sweden.

Emibas CD:

Post 49063

Pehrsson Staf, Pehr
Bonde = farmer (married man)

b. 12/24/1815 in Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)

Emigrated 3/?/1873
from Nyland, Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)
to Minnesota, USA

Source: Household Examination Roll, p. 72

Emibas migration file ID: Undersåker Z 1873 001

Un-normalized versions:

Place of destination: Minnesota
Country of destination: USA

Post 49064

Hansdotter, Märta
Hustru = wife (married woman)

b. 2/9/1812 in Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)

Emigrated 3/?/1873
from Nyland, Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)
to Minnesota, USA

Source: Household Examination Roll, p. 72

Emibas migration file ID: Undersåker Z 1873 002

Un-normalized versions:

Place of destination: Minnesota
Country of destination: USA

Post 49065

Pehrsdotter Staf, Märet
Dotter = daughter (unmarried woman)

b. 6/17/1842 in Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)

Emigrated 3/?/1873
from Nyland, Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)
to Minnesota, USA

Source: Household Examination Roll, p. 72

Emibas migration file ID: Undersåker Z 1873 003

Un-normalized versions:

Place of destination: Minnesota
Country of destination: USA

Post 49066

Pehrsson Staf, Pehr Jonas
Son = son (unmarried man)

b. 9/8/1852 in Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)

Emigrated 3/?/1873
from Nyland, Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)
to Minnesota, USA

Source: Household Examination Roll, p. 72

Emibas migration file ID: Undersåker Z 1873 004

Un-normalized versions:

Place of destination: Minnesota
Country of destination: USA

Post 49067

Pehrsson Staf, Gustaf
Son (unmarried man)

b. 11/28/1855 in Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)

Emigrated 3/?/1873
from Nyland, Undersåker, Jämtlands län (Jämtland)
to Minnesota, USA

Source: Household Examination Roll, p. 72

Emibas migration file ID: Undersåker Z 1873 005

Un-normalized versions:

Place of destination: Minnesota
Country of destination: USA

I don't see the birth of Pehr Pehrsson Staf in the Undersåker birth records on that date.

A researcher on the DISBYT database has this information. (He probably has more, so if you need his contact information, contact me privately.)

http://disbyt.dis.se/dbyt_e_index.htm

http://www.sandinfamily.com/genealogy-resources/disbyt-instr...

Family card of Per* Persson Staf
Per* Persson Staf
b 1763 Kall, Jämtlands län (-) ;
d 1847 Kall, Jämtlands län (**) ;
Margret Persdotter
b 1770 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
d 1848 Kall, Jämtlands län (**) ;
Per* Persson Staf
b 1815 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
Married to Märta Hansdotter
b 1812 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
Per Persson
b 1839 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
Märet Persdotter
b 1842 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
Hans Persson
b 1846 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
Olof Persson
b 1849 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
Per Jonas Persson
b 1852 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;
Gustaf Persson
b 1855 Kall, Jämtlands län (****) ;

I did find the birth of Per Persson Staf in Kall parish on 24 December 1815.

http://www.arkivdigital.net (subscription)

Kall C:3 (1805-1853) Image 500 / page 89 (AID: v114672.b500.s89, NAD: SE/ÖLA/11066)

Judy

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

mloncaric13 — 2013-05-24 19:17:13Z

Hi Ingela --

After the divorce, Sven knocks around for about 7 more years (he dies in 1830); I can't tell what work he does, but, again, he is always described as a tailor in these later records (out of respect?). If he did become a mason, his son followed him in the trade.

I figured the guild would be strict, but reasonable: his wife's adultery was not his shame...but, well, perhaps it was. Eva must've caused quite a stir, not only with the carryings-on -- extensive, from what I can tell from the records -- but her public drunkenness, the stealing, the begging, the prison time. I could see the guild perhaps not wanting to kick him out, but feeling forced to, because of public sentiment, guarding their own reputations.

Yes, I should send a query to the Archive about the guilds. They were very helpful (if a little backlogged) in this matter of the divorce papers.

What I might do with these records is post the last 2 pages or so, where there may be a summing-up and let it go at that. The clerk-hand changes once or twice; the latter pages may be easier!!!

Thank you for the guild investigation suggestion. It's a clue I never would've considered, as he continued to appear to be a tailor until his death.

Thanks again --

Meredith

Re: searching history on my father

Lundpe — 2013-05-24 18:36:10Z

Saw your post on the Nilsson site, but it is less confusing to try to answere here.

Can you provide a few other pieces of info?

When did your father die?
What was your mothers name?
Do you know where they lived? Was it always Nebraska?

one or two more pieces and I may be able to find him in Sweden.

Do you the month or day of his birth?

Thanks Peter Lundberg

Re: Nilsson

JOBaouab — 2013-05-24 18:20:52Z

http://svenskanamn.alltforforaldrar.se/visa/Henning

"Mansnamnet Henning är ett forntyskt namn med oklart ursprung. Det kan härstamma från Johannes eller Henrik. Enligt en tolkning betyder det "den som stiftar fred". Och enligt en annan betyder det "den skicklige"."

Which roughly means...

The male name Henning is an Old German name of uncertain origin. It may be descended from Johannes or Henrik. According to one interpretation, it means "the one making peace." And according to another, it means "the skilled".

This page provides ideas on how to try to find the father of an illegitimate child in Sweden.

http://tinyurl.com/chq8tb3

Judy

Re: Nilsson

martin48115 — 2013-05-24 18:09:40Z

In the 19th century there were no general rules for how a child should be named (except for the patronymic surname). It is likely that his mother choose the given names that were popular where she lived. Henning was and is just another name without any special meaning.

Martin

Re: Nilsson

Lundpe — 2013-05-24 18:00:43Z

Thanks Martin, but I have a question. I still have much to learn.

One of the illegitimate children carried the name Erik Henning. (Seen in the census of 1890 and in family records.) I just read an article that stated that Henning in Baltic Languages was a way of stating he bore his fathers name. Did Swedes follow this? So are we looking for a father named Erik?

Re: Nystrom-Persson-Staff

alananystrom — 2013-05-24 17:35:30Z

Are you a distant relative of Per Person? My husband is his great, great, great grandson (through the line of Per/Peter Staf, Hans Nystrom, Peter H Nystrom, and Lowell Nystrom). We are actually going to Sweden in just over a week and we are going to try to visit some of the areas our families lived. Have you found out any more info on Per Person (such as who his parents were or where exactly they lived)?

Thanks,
Alana Nystrom
763-302-9291

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

isulv — 2013-05-24 16:12:08Z

I read "mureri" (masonry) as "marin" (marine, navy) and couldn't make sense of it. "Mureri-arbetaren" does make sense! A masonry worker wasn't in a guild but worked for a master at the most unqualified jobs.

Maybe the tailor's guild threw him out. Not impossible since a divorce because the wife slept with another man (moreover, another guild!) must have caused a gigantic scandal at the time. Perhaps no master tailor would hire him after that - a guild took care of its own, and it does seem remarkable that a journeyman of long standing was forced to send his children to the orphanage instead of the guild-members helping out.
The guilds were very particular about marriage and being born in wedlock etc.

Doesn't the Stockholm Archive have all documents pertaining to different guilds? If they didn't actually throw Swen out, they must at least have debated the situation. Even if he voluntarily left the guild it must be noted.

Ingela

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

mloncaric13 — 2013-05-24 16:04:40Z

Hi --

Thank you again for the translations...For Sven to become an apothecary at age 56 would seem to make sense if his brother/cousin/whichever relative (the Johan Kantzov I wrote of earlier) was an established apothecary and was willing to take him into the business.

That said, Sven's son, Anders (b. 1809), was a mason worker in his adult life. Sven becoming a mason worker in the 1820's can also fit the picture, as then we see his son following in his footsteps.

In post-1823 (the date of the divorce record) household examinations and on his death record, his is, however, consistently described as a tailor.

I thank you for taking the time to try to decipher this material. It is frustrating, as I have a wealth of information -- 21 pages -- but the interpretation (even the reading of the words, for me) is very challenging.

Meredith

Re: Nilsson

martin48115 — 2013-05-24 15:56:58Z

"Hennes" is not a name, it means "Her". Her illegitimate daughter.

Martin

Re: Olof Jonsson b 1809 married Anna Stina Andersdtr b 12 Feb 1807

bjorn_nilsson — 2013-05-24 15:20:32Z

Hi Harold !
Can you mess me by mail ?
bjorn.nilsson@bonil.se
I can tell you Little more of Olof Jonsson and Anna Stina Andersdotter if you like .
// Bjorn

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

bohjohan — 2013-05-24 15:17:04Z

I read it as "numera apothekaren", but I agree it looks more like "nu mureri-arbetaren".

Perhaps he wasn't very successful as tailor...

// Bo Johansson

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

martin48115 — 2013-05-24 14:01:36Z

I dare suggest mureri-arbetaren (mason worker ?) instead of apotekaren.

Martin

Re: Nilsson

Lundpe — 2013-05-24 13:18:00Z

more info on Hulda Josephina
the emigration records have her last name as Larsson when she comes to the US. Hopefully Lars was her father.

Post 83422

Larsson, Hulda Josefina
Piga (unmarried woman)

b. 3/27/1858 in Hov, Östergötlands län (Östergötland)

Emigrated 5/12/1873
from Bondorlunda, Hov, Östergötlands län (Östergötland)
to Nordamerika

Source: Household Examination Roll, p. 260

Emibas migration file ID: Hov E 1873 005

Her birth record is attached Hov C:5 (1844-1892) Image 20 / page 31 (AID: v37836.b20.s31, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

Re: Nilsson

Lundpe — 2013-05-24 13:08:52Z

Trying to make sense of the data. So Erik Henning Nilsson was born 12 Mar, baptized the 13 Mar 1874 in Hov to unmarried K Nilson in Bondurlunda, Hov and found on page 260 of the household records.

Hov C:7 (1866-1894) Image 31 / page 28 (AID: v37838.b31.s28, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

The household record shows :

Nils Persson's widow Christina Nillson born 23 Mar 1797 in Gammalkil, married in 1835 , became a widow in 1869 moved from Filipstad in 1839
Her daughter was Karin Milson born 21 May 1829 in Vikingstad, moved from Krokek in 55

She had an illegitimate daughter named Hulda Josephina born 27 Mar 1858 in Hov (f is modernized to v) there is a note in the records that says Hulda migrated to the US 12 May 1873
Another illegitimate daughter Emille Augusta born 8 Dec 1865 in Hov
Then you see illegitimate Erik Henning born 12 Mar 1874 in Hov

source Hov AI:11 (1866-1875) Image 270 / page 260 (AID: v25995.b270.s260, NAD: SE/VALA/00142)

I will see what else I can dig up

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

mloncaric13 — 2013-05-24 11:40:30Z

Hi Bo --

Thank you for your input! That he might have become an apothecary is very interesting and perhaps suggestive...There is a Kantzov or Kantzou family in Stockholm around this time period. I have tried -- without success -- to link Sven (who appears to be without mother, father, siblings, other ties except for his own progeny) with these Kantzovs.

The Kantzovs came from Vaasa, Finland and, while the church records for that area are online and I have, with help, perused them, the baptism book for 1763-1768 is missing, precisely the years that I would need to search. There are Household Examination records, though, for around that time and years after, so we checked those. The Kantzov family in Vaasa does not seem to have a son named Sven (or even a child of his close age), so it seems that they are not, indeed, Sven's immediate family.

What makes Sven becoming an apothecary so interesting is that Johan Kantzov, from Vaasa, now (1820's) in Stockholm, is also an apothecary. Would becoming an apothecary after being a tailor for many years be a usual career change?

This mystery gets even more interesting...

Meredith

Re: Where do they live?

ängby — 2013-05-24 07:39:41Z

Hi Hal,
The family lived at "Stocklanda Laskog", you can find the family at GID: 738.44.48200, [Älvsborg] Högsäter, AI:14, Husförhör, 1825 - 1830, 390/0, Bild 215 av 248 or on AD-Online at AID: Högsäter AI:14 (1825-1830) Bild 201 / sid 391 (AID: v4336.b201.s391, NAD: SE/GLA/13252).

Hope this will be helpful for you!

Have a nice day!

Don

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

bohjohan — 2013-05-24 06:15:23Z

Perhaps: former journeyman tailor now "apotekaren" (the apothecary, pharmacist).

// Bo Johansson

Re: Muster Roll Translation - Hans Johansson Boman

roconnor199 — 2013-05-24 04:31:06Z

Dear Karl-Henrik

Thank you very much indeed for translating this first Muster Roll for me and providing the additional information about Hans & his wife (some of which I had, and some I didn't).

That Hans joined the Smaland Cavalry Regiment in September 1709 is fascinating. Sweden had just been crushingly defeated by the Russians at Poltava in June and Hans must have been one of the new recruits to replace those many lost in Russia. Also, the Danes invaded southern Sweden shortly after in February 1710 and were defeated by the Swedes at Helsingborg on 28 February 1710. Hans and his regiment, I would think, probably served in that campaign.

The Muster Roll detail concerning Hans is fascinating. It confirms his birthplace and gives some detail of his service and loss of his horse!

Thank you very much again.

Regards
Robert

Re: Nilsson

srnilsson — 2013-05-24 04:07:16Z

Sorry, not able to help you

Where do they live?

19sweden94 — 2013-05-24 01:34:11Z

GID 738.26.41500 in Hogsater, Alvsborg Johannes Falk and his wife Stina Jonsdtr.

All help welcome.

Hal Bern

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

mloncaric13 — 2013-05-24 01:27:37Z

Hi Ingela -

Isn't it crazy? The handwriting is quite spidery and of course faint in some places, thick in others, which obscures the letters. I do appreciate you taking a look, despite the Herculean task it presents.

Yes: Sven gives his birth year as December 1764 and/or 1767; usually, it is 1764. Eva was born in 1780 in Gottrora. I have a copy of his and Eva's banns from Solna, which is amended with the date of their actual marriage: 1802. From what I can tell, they met in 1801 in Solna.

The children are finally asleep and I have my chance to do some more dedicated examination. It would seem to me that personal information would be presented in the beginning of the record (or, possibly, at the end), and yet my inexpert scans don't yield much. Most of the document seems to be made of depositions from witnesses, the statement of Sven Cantzoff himself, what appear to be fines, etc. All extremely personally and sociologically interesting, but not specific to the details I am looking for re: Sven.

There are a few dates listed: 1797 and 1741, but neither of these ring any bells with what I know (and seem out of context with the matter at hand, though, of course, I am getting perhaps 10% or less of what is going on).

Well, thank you so much for taking a peek. I may select one or two pages that seem (to me) to be most significant and post them. My mother's friend Marta, who is from Stockholm and would love to be of help, is nearing 90 and I cannot see her -- nor could I ask her -- reading/deciphering the handwriting. I could try to read to her, but then we would all have a good laugh and call it a day.

Again, thanks for your input!

Meredith

Re: Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

isulv — 2013-05-24 01:08:04Z

Not easy! Haven't got very much time right now, but I can tell you that Swen is said to be 56 years old "now", i.e. 1823, which means he was born in 1767. He and Ewa were married "23 years ago", i.e. 1800 exactly.

BTW, the court record is for 06 July 1823.

Swen is said to be "former journeyman tailor", but I can't make out what he is now.

Ingela

Re: Eric Hedburg

SavannahsLord — 2013-05-23 22:23:42Z

Thank you Eva. It is a lot of information to take in.

Lynn

GID 738.43.7900 in Hogsater, Alvsborg

19sweden94 — 2013-05-23 22:00:46Z

Where is she from - Karin Danielsdtr b 1791 in Ryd?????

All help welcome.

Hal Bern

Re: Where is Ryd?

Harold_Bern — 2013-05-23 21:28:54Z

Thank you, Nils

Hal Bern

Re: Petter Niclas Birth Record Transcription

eric_c_olson — 2013-05-23 17:04:48Z

Thanks Bo for clearing that up for me.

Re: Muster Roll Translation - Hans Johansson Boman

kryden1 — 2013-05-23 11:00:10Z

Hello Robert,
Hans Johansson Boman was a cavalier, I think enlisted for the Rote Övlandahult in Ökna parish, Jönköpings län.
He was born June 25 1689 in Boanäs, Karlstorp parish and died July 11 1770 in Knivshult, also Karlstorp parish. He was married to Elisabeth Olofsdotter, who was born March 7 1689 in Knivshult. You may already know this, but I want to put it all in perspective. We had a discussion about him here a while ago:
http://aforum.genealogi.se/cgi-bin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=44&am... (in swedish, use Google translate)
I can not read all in this note from the 1712 GMR (Generalmönsterrulla), but I will try some to give you a clue about what it is concerning:
"
nr 54 Överhult Hans Boman.
Är barnfödd i Småland och Karlstorps socken, antagen till Ryttare i Sept Månad 1709, 22 år gl. lärdt smedehandtwärked?
samt kan läsa och skriva
svart häst med liten stjierna? 14 år gammal.

En? bekomit svart halsduk Los?...fornia? skrapa och .. bårta i Cubin hölster? Tomistow foraspil? ?
förkommit på Marchen till Ericksholm

Hästen nyl. bortkommen på bun??? dåck förmenad? att komma till rätta igen. "

translates:
"
nr 54 Överhult Hans Boman.
Was (child)born in Småland and Karlstorps parish, approved as Cavalier in September month 1709, 22 years old has learned as a blacksmith? and is able to read and write.

A black horse with a small star? 14 years old.
Has become a black scarf? ????? a rake? and ?? lost? in Curbin, holster? Tomistow ??? lost during the march to Ericksholm.

The horse is recently lost at ? but it is expected that it will be found again."

I think Curbin, Tomistow and Ericksholm are places visited during the campain.

Best regards,
Karl-Henrik

PS You may try to email me at kalle@mailcity.com

Re: Petter Niclas Birth Record Transcription

bohjohan — 2013-05-23 06:37:07Z

The parents' address is number 21(?) Backa.

"Kyrkt. d. 3/9 af P.L." = [mother] received in church the 3rd Sep by P.L.

Mother's age 27.

The list of names in the column to the right are the witnesses ("Faddrar"), who might or might not be related, and the last column have their addresses.

"M-Faddr." (mans-faddrar) = male witnesses

"Q-Faddr." (qvinno-faddrar) = female witnesses

// Bo Johansson

Re: Where is Ryd?

Nils_Lindgren — 2013-05-23 04:47:24Z

Hi

Probably the parish in county of Skaraborg

Nils

Where is Ryd?

19sweden94 — 2013-05-23 00:01:17Z

GID 738.43.7900 in Hogsater, Alvsborg Page 31 in 1821-1825 section.

All help appreciated.

Hal Bern

Re: Muster Roll Translation - Hans Johansson Boman

roconnor199 — 2013-05-22 22:24:44Z

Thanks Jeff - your comments and help are much appreciated. I obtained these images on SVAR - they are for the Smalands Cavalry Regiment, Svetlanda Company, Rote 54. In each case there was only one muster in each year.

Regards
Robert

Re: Muster Roll Translation - Hans Johansson Boman

jabenson43 — 2013-05-22 20:57:32Z

It's not that we don't want to help you with your four muster rolls... Unfortunately, the images you posted are all too small and/or indistinct to decipher, at least for my eyes.

Rather than post larger images, it would be *much* better if you would provide the source details for each so helpers can look up the original record. In other words, provide the page number or, failing that (not all musters are paginated), at least provide the name of the company your Boman served under. Generally, there were 8 companies in a regiment and it's a pain to have to potentially search all of them to find the right rote (in other words, there was a soldier #54 in *every* company so the rote number isn't sufficient). Image numbers are generally less valuable since they don't translate between services but you could include that as well. (I assume you must have found these images on either Arkiv Digital or SVAR.) Some muster rolls included multiple musters in the same volume (for example, musters taken on two different dates in the same year). If that's the case, please tell us which muster (the first? second? third?) your image came from.

Jeff

Court Records for 1825 Divorce: Translation Help, Please

mloncaric13 — 2013-05-22 20:50:36Z

Hi --

I have recently received the court records for my ancestors' divorce in about 1825, Stockholm. The actual document is 21 pages long and would be, I think, a time-consuming challenge to translate all at once(or I know it would be for me, Swedish dictionary by my side!). But I wondered if someone could help with a few pages here and there, so I can get a more detailed sense of was transpired in the divorce.

My main interest in these records is information about Sven Cantzoff; he appears in Stockholm records in 1800, but not before. He gives his birth year as 1764 in subsequent records, but no place of birth (anywhere). My hope is that the court records may provide some clues to his origin...

Again, I know this is a difficult request -- and I sincerely appreciate any and all help. I am trying any avenue I can think of to figure out where Sven Cantzoff came from; I am hoping to find some ideas in these records.

Thank you very much for your interest; I am grateful to this message board in general for all the help -- and support -- members have generously given me.

Meredith

Re: Translation Help with 1825 Divorce Document

mloncaric13 — 2013-05-22 20:39:00Z

Hi Ingela –

You suggest a good plan: parceling out a page or two of the court record for help with translation. I am sure that the translation itself would be easy (if a little drenched in pomposity!)…but only if one did not have to deal with the creative spelling and the archaic handwriting. It is then, as it would seem to me, a difficult task; I am fortunate to have found such generous help on this message board. I never would have thought people so interested and willing to share their expertise with a stranger (though, to be fair, a stranger who is a compatriot in the genealogical adventure).

I will post a few pages (I received it as a PDF, so have to transfer it into a Word or .jpg) on the general board and cross my fingers that someone has the patience!

Yes: the Finnish search. It was suggested to me – and I can tell myself – that Cantzoff is not originally a Swedish name. It transmuted into Kantzow by the 1850’s (and there were Kantzows in Stockholm at that time, but – as far as I am able to tell – they are not related and were of a higher social class), but the original seems to be Cantzoff or Cantzov. I’ve done some research in Finnish records online to no avail as of yet. Sven seems to spring from the ground in his mid-thirties to be recorded in Storkyrkan parish tax rolls in early 1800. He’s an apprentice at the time and that’s why I’ve been trying the guild angle.

From what you explain, getting hold of Sven’s guild application/documents would provide firm clues to his origin. Thank you so much for your discussion of what he had to do to become a member…It helps give more “shape” to his experience and character, and how he and his family lived. I had a hazy image of a small, dingy room, children in rags, etc., etc. That Sven was a professional and could/perhaps did make a decent income explains – maybe – why Eva Ekbom married him. I had wondered why a relatively young girl (she was 22) would marry a 38 year old man and this information, combined with the fact that their first son was born about 6 months after their marriage, clarifies things. Again, perhaps!

I had no idea about the orphanage; I assumed that the children were placed there by the city or by a special plea from their parents. Clearly, I am operating with a contemporary mindset. And, clearly, my Swedish pick-and-mix translation efforts miss clues (for example, that the boys were placed with Anders Andersson). Since Eva was a regular “visitor” in the prison on Langenholmen, she obviously wasn’t taking care of the children and Sven may not have wanted her to. Their last child, Carl, who died in infancy, was born in 1814, and I suspect that’s when things began to go downhill.

Sven is becoming more and more of a compelling character to me…What a life. Of his 6 children, 4 survive infancy, one dies in his twenties, one ends up in and out of the Sabbatsburg poorhouse, his 1 daughter remains unmarried (though is a fairly successful seamstress, with an apprentice girl of her own) – only Arvid Lorentz, my direct ancestor, seems to flourish. He becomes a cabinetmaker/carpenter and moves to Hernosand, Vasternorrland and raises his family.

I can’t tell you how much I enjoy your discussion! I appreciate the insight into my little family dramas that you provide. There is no way I could have gained the understanding that I believe I am acquiring without your help.

Thank you – and take care –
Meredith

Re: Skogsberg Family

misty694 — 2013-05-22 20:33:56Z

sioux city, iowa