Forsyth - Family History & Genealogy Message Board

Books on the Forsyth Family

StellaS77 — 2009-11-06 22:41:20Z

Greetings,

I just found a new online bookstore that gives away FREE SEARCHABLE CD-ROM with the purchase of any family history book, they have over 20,000 titles to choose from, I just tought that I will pass it along to you.

Their address is www.ancestralbooks.com

Books that I was able to find from their website for my research:

A Genealogical Record Forsyth of Nydie - by Forsyth, Frederick G
New Market, VA , 1888

A History of the Forsyth Family - by Jeffries, Jennie Forsyth
Indianapolis, IN , 1920

Memorial of the De Forsyths de Fronsac - by Forsyth, Frederic
Boston, MA , 1897

Memorial of the Family Forsyth de Fronsac - by Forsyth de Fronsac, Frederic G.
Boston, MA , 1903

FORSYTH Alice Claire SISTER 1913-2004

t42MountOlivet — 2009-11-04 16:28:06Z

FORSYTH Alice Claire SISTER 1913-2004

I photographed this gravestone in the Mount Olivet Cemetery, Fort Worth, Tarrant Co., Texas. Feel free to use this picture for your personal records. This is one of the 209,237 cemetery photos free at http://teafor2.com

If you know more about this person please reply here instead of contacting me because this is most likely not my family.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 19:19:14Z

Dear cousin,

Here is an update for your use/information!

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. (The cover sheet of this court record has the name Nuuhiwa instead of Luahiwa.) He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to the internet. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey. I am pleased to say that I am in communication with three of the Godfrey descendants today; they are my Ohana cousins.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, Ka'ili'kuiku'olono, and Theophilus Sabin Meka Metcalf. Why? We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well under the cloak of darkness, for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other Forsyth/Metcalf/Godfrey cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied for economic reasonsm and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 19:17:09Z

Dear cousin,

Here is an update for your use/information!

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. (The cover sheet of this court record has the name Nuuhiwa instead of Luahiwa.) He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to the internet. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, Ka'ili'kuiku'olono, and Theophilus Sabin Meka Metcalf. Why? We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well under the cloak of darkness, for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other Forsyth/Metcalf/Godfrey cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied for economic reasonsm and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 19:13:09Z

Feel free to link anything you wish of mine in anyway you wish. Aloha, Cousin Puanani

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 19:03:17Z

Hello, dear Keoki and/or cousin Thomas.....

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

As far as we can discern, both Alice and George, were born within the marriage years....of Thomas Charles and Luahiwa. The problem is that one descending line (at least) seems to believe that while George came from Luahiwa, Alice did not. On the other hand our research says George did not come from Luahiwa; he came from Luahiwa's sister.

Both lines cooperate to get at the Truth- whatever it may be. Until new documents of some kind can be found, it is natural to assume that the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas during his marriage to Luahiwa- a marriage not violated by adultery by Thomas but violated by adultery by Luahiwa....according to Thomas and seemingly agreed upon by Luahiwa at the trial...

until new documents can be found, this descendant is going to list Thomas Charles and Luahiwa as her great great great grandparents.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

Grandpa insisted that he had never violated his marriage vows like Luahiwa had just done. Luahiwa did not challenge this assertion of Grandpa's.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to cousin lines. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey. I am pleased to be in very good relationship with three of the Godfrey descendants...my dear Ohana cousins.

My documents assure me that I can at least make a believable case in any court to back up my assumption that Thomas Charles and Luahiwa are my great great great maternal grandparents.

I ask other descendants of one or both these people to let me know of any other documents in their possession- that may cause me to have to alter my beliefs.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, Ka'ili'kuiki'olono, Alida Metcalf, Minamina/Kahaleahu/Kahaleohu Keawe, and Theophilus Sabin Meka Metcalf at least. Why? We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well "under the cloak of darkness," for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other Forsyth/Metcalf/Godfrey cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied for economic reasons and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites as lots/homes had to be sold. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Who would have the nerve to remove iwi from the "Westminster Church of the Pacific?"
Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi in her own plot...
deeded for eternity to church members (not church leaders of subsequent generations)...of King Kamehameha III's Hawaiian Kingdom time especially.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:58:32Z

Hello, dear Keoki and/or cousin Thomas.....

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

As far as we can discern, both Alice and George, were born within the marriage years....of Thomas Charles and Luahiwa. The problem is that one descending line (at least) seems to believe that while George came from Luahiwa, Alice did not. On the other hand our research says George did not come from Luahiwa; he came from Luahiwa's sister.

Both lines cooperate to get at the Truth- whatever it may be. Until new documents of some kind can be found, it is natural to assume that the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas during his marriage to Luahiwa- a marriage not violated by adultery by Thomas but violated by adultery by Luahiwa....according to Thomas and seemingly agreed upon by Luahiwa at the trial...

until new documents can be found, this descendant is going to list Thomas Charles and Luahiwa as her great great great grandparents.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

Grandpa insisted that he had never violated his marriage vows like Luahiwa had just done. Luahiwa did not challenge this assertion of Grandpa's.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to cousin lines. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey. I am pleased to be in very good relationship with three of the Godfrey descendants...my dear Ohana cousins.

My documents assure me that I can at least make a believable case in any court to back up my assumption that Thomas Charles and Luahiwa are my great great great maternal grandparents.

I ask other descendants of one or both these people to let me know of any other documents in their possession- that may cause me to have to alter my beliefs.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, Ka'ili'kuiki'olono, Alida Metcalf, Minamina/Kahaleahu/Kahaleohu Keawe, and Theophilus Sabin Meka Metcalf at least. Why? We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well "under the cloak of darkness,"
for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other Forsyth/Metcalf/Godfrey cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied for economic reasonsm and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:56:16Z

Hello, dear Keoki and/or cousin Thomas.....

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

As far as we can discern, both Alice and George, were born within the marriage years....of Thomas Charles and Luahiwa. The problem is that one descending line (at least) seems to believe that while George came from Luahiwa, Alice did not. On the other hand our research says George did not come from Luahiwa; he came from Luahiwa's sister.

Both lines cooperate to get at the Truth- whatever it may be. Until new documents of some kind can be found, it is natural to assume that the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas during his marriage to Luahiwa- a marriage not violated by adultery by Thomas but violated by adultery by Luahiwa....according to Thomas and seemingly agreed upon by Luahiwa at the trial...

until new documents can be found, this descendant is going to list Thomas Charles and Luahiwa as her great great great grandparents.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

Grandpa insisted that he had never violated his marriage vows like Luahiwa had just done. Luahiwa did not challenge this assertion of Grandpa's.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to cousin lines. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey. I am pleased to be in very good relationship with three of the Godfrey descendants...my dear Ohana cousins.

My documents assure me that I can at least make a believable case in any court to back up my assumption that Thomas Charles and Luahiwa are my great great great maternal grandparents.

I ask other descendants of one or both these people to let me know of any other documents in their possession- that may cause me to have to alter my beliefs.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, Ka'ili'kuiku'olono, Alida Metcalf, Minamina/Kahaleahu/Kahaleohu Keawe, and Theophilus Sabin Meka Metcalf at least. Why? We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well "under the cloak of darkness,"
for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other Forsyth/Metcalf/Godfrey cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied for economic reasonsm and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:54:14Z

Hello, dear Keoki and/or cousin Thomas.....

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

As far as we can discern, both Alice and George, were born within the marriage years....of Thomas Charles and Luahiwa. The problem is that one descending line (at least) seems to believe that while George came from Luahiwa, Alice did not. On the other hand our research says George did not come from Luahiwa; he came from Luahiwa's sister.

Both lines cooperate to get at the Truth- whatever it may be. Until new documents of some kind can be found, it is natural to assume that the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas during his marriage to Luahiwa- a marriage not violated by adultery by Thomas but violated by adultery by Luahiwa....according to Thomas and seemingly agreed upon by Luahiwa at the trial...

until new documents can be found, this descendant is going to list Thomas Charles and Luahiwa as her great great great grandparents.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

Grandpa insisted that he had never violated his marriage vows like Luahiwa had just done. Luahiwa did not challenge this assertion of Grandpa's.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to cousin lines. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey. I am pleased to be in very good relationship with three of the Godfrey descendants.

My documents assure me that I can at least make a believable case in any court to back up my assumption that Thomas Charles and Luahiwa are my great great great maternal grandparents.

I ask other descendants of one or both these people to let me know of any other documents in their possession- that may cause me to have to alter my beliefs.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, Ka'ili'kuiku'olono, Alida Metcalf, Minamina/Kahaleahu/Kahaleohu Keawe, and Theophilus Sabin Meka Metcalf at least. Why? We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well "under the cloak of darkness,"
for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other Forsyth/Metcalf/Godfrey cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied for economic reasonsm and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:49:37Z

Hello, dear Keoki and/or cousin Thomas.....

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

As far as we can discern, both Alice and George, were born within the marriage years....of Thomas Charles and Luahiwa. The problem is that one descending line (at least) seems to believe that while George came from Luahiwa, Alice did not. On the other hand our research says George did not come from Luahiwa; he came from Luahiwa's sister.

Both lines cooperate to get at the Truth- whatever it may be. Until new documents of some kind can be found, it is natural to assume that the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas during his marriage to Luahiwa- a marriage not violated by adultery by Thomas but violated by adultery by Luahiwa....according to Thomas and seemingly agreed upon by Luahiwa at the trial...

until new documents can be found, this descendant is going to list Thomas Charles and Luahiwa as her great great great grandparents.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

Grandpa insisted that he had never violated his marriage vows like Luahiwa had just done. Luahiwa did not challenge this assertion of Grandpa's.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to cousin lines. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey. I am pleased to be in very good relationship with three of the Godfrey descendants.

My documents assure me that I can at least make a believable case in any court to back up my assumption that Thomas Charles and Luahiwa are my great great great maternal grandparents.

I ask other descendants of one or both these people to let me know of any other documents in their possession- that may cause me to have to alter my beliefs.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, Ka'ili'kuiku'olono, and Theophilus Sabin Meka Metcalf. Why? We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well under the cloak of darkness, for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other Forsyth/Metcalf/Godfrey cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied for economic reasonsm and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:30:38Z

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:22:20Z

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:21:38Z

Hello, dear Keioki and/or cousin Thomas.....

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to the internet. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, and Ka'ili'kuiku'olono. Why: We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well under the cloak of darkness, for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-10-22 18:20:03Z

Hello, dear cousin Thomas.....

So far we know that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf Godfrey along with her brother George, are the two children certified by court as being the children of Thomas Charles Forsyth at the time his estate needed to be probated.

We also know that in 1855 Thomas Charles Forsyth divorced Luahiwa Forsyth (his wife)...for adultery. He says she went out one night with a Mr. Pohaku and came back pregnant. As he said that, she was in court listening and holding a baby which grandpa insisted was not his child.

This divorce issue has been posted on the internet (originally) by a cousin. The two-children-of -Thomas-Charles information may be new to the internet. I now post that tidbit to clear up whatever questions may still linger on that issue with cousin lines/researchers.

We know from our research experience that: Women who had children in olden times saw such children given their (birth mothers') surname, even if the children were not the keiki of the birth mothers' legal/current/past husbands.

Hence, four or five children of grandma Alice's children by Mr. Frank Godfrey, became Metcalfs despite the fact that grandpa Frank Metcalf testified in court that the keiki of his estranged wife were not his children, but that of Mr. Godfrey. Later those same children, if survived into adulthood, changed their names to Godfrey.

Feel free to email me at lucasta@earthlink.net. Or call me at 625-2610. If you ever are on Oahu, let me know. I would be pleased to meet you.

Love and aloha, from Puanani

Presently, we watch over grandma's Metcalf plot at Kawaiaha'o Church cemetary. We believe that many more iwi are buried there besides the few for which we have burial documents. We know: Great great Alice Forsyth Metcalf, baby Alice, Everline/Eveline, great great grandpa Frank Metcalf, grand uncle William Thomas Metcalf and Step-great great grandpa Frank Godfrey are buried there. We look for the burial sites of Luahiwa Kulaiwa Forsyth (unless we get factual proof she is elsewhere), Ka'ilikapu'olono, Ka'ili'alakua'olono, and Ka'ili'kuiku'olono. Why: We wonder if their iwi might have been buried there as well under the cloak of darkness, for we know such things were done in the early 20th century and grandma Alice was more than capable of such- especially because other cemetaries/mausoleums/yard grave sites were being emptied and the Metcalfs/Forsyths/Godfreys had to move iwi to more secure burial sites. The family always considered the Kawaiaha'o Plot, known as the Metcalf Plot...to be the most secure. Alice was the owner; it is natural to assume that she would gladly take possession of homeless iwi of any relations, because as long as she lived...she was the most stable and "able" to house iwi.

FORSYTH Hugh 1894-1956

t42MountOlivet — 2009-10-13 16:41:00Z

FORSYTH Hugh 1894-1956

I photographed this gravestone in the Mount Olivet Cemetery, Fort Worth, Tarrant Co., Texas. Feel free to use this picture for your personal records. This is one of the 207,686 cemetery photos free at http://teafor2.com

If you know more about this person please reply here instead of contacting me because this is most likely not my family.

FORSYTH Hugh 1894-1956

t42MountOlivet — 2009-10-13 16:40:37Z

FORSYTH Hugh 1894-1956

Re: Forsyth's in NJ

oldsmobill_1 — 2009-09-23 22:56:44Z

forgot my uncle Chester Forsyth 1916?-1943? died at 26 from heart attack form a cloged artery

Re: Forsyth's in NJ

oldsmobill_1 — 2009-09-23 22:52:20Z

my grandfatherWilliam j Forsyth had a grocery store in the oranges, died in the early forties...maried edith m-ills
circa 1917;two children-WILLIAM A.1914-1964...married Christene Davis 1913-1984...two children William J.1942-...
Barbra Lucile1943-2009..,possibly related?

Re: Anyone Related???

DorisForsyth18 — 2009-07-12 04:38:56Z

Where did your Forsyths originate, do you know? Mine came to the US from England in the early 1900's and settled in Osage County, Kansas. I don't have a Frank Forsyth, but would like to know where your Forsyths were before they show up in this country.

Doris Reed Forsyth

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

JForsythe2321 — 2009-06-19 12:29:33Z

I am watching this dialogue on the Forsythe/e line from Hawaii with great interest.
My husbands grandfather was George Forsythe and the only information we have on him is that he was (according to his marriage license) 21 years old in 1924 and on my father-in-laws birth certificate it states his father was born in Hawaii. As you probably know – dates are not always accurate and I am leaning toward our George may be the one listed in the Hawaii 1910 Census that has a George and Walter Forsythe listed with the family of William and Mary Forsythe as nephews. My husbands fathers name is Walter too (just thought I’d throw that in the mix). Our George disappeared after Walter was born – although we have a sibling of Walters named Richard Forsythe born in 1926.
The only death certificate I can find is for a George Forsythe in San Francisco, CA born about 1903 and died 11/9/1931.
I have sent some of this information to cousins in Hawaii but have had no contact with them since they have received the information.
I am very interesting in learning more on this line of our family. If anyone can help me I would greatly appreciate it.

Warm regards,
Jackie Forsythe
jlforysyhe@mail.com

Re: Anyone Related???

pjw1212 — 2009-05-16 20:13:59Z

Can you please give some dates and location for Frank G. FORSYTH(E). My Frank was b. 1883 IN, probably South Bend. He married Sylvia COTTRELL c1903, but later divorced. Frank died after 1944.

Re: Anyone Related???

pjw1212 — 2009-07-11 00:10:29Z

Previous post: My grandfather was Frank G. Forsyth and married Dorothy Chapman. Passed away in the late 60's.

Where did Frank G. live? I'm confused between a Frank G. and Frank M. in South Bend, St. Joseph County, IN, 1880's-1940's or later. Frank's father was John W. Forsyth(e). Does he fit with your Frank G?

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

kamakeeainaohana — 2009-06-19 21:20:40Z

Then know that he was a formen at the Laie Plantation and was in charge of the child labor force.

We may be missing Tilton information, be we have everything you have outlined so far in this forum, so I will look at our tree and see if there is anything missing.

I know which line Kiha descends from, the information was in my previous response, and yes, it is Frank Lalio Tilton.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

kamakeeainaohana — 2009-06-19 21:11:19Z

Puanani:

Just sent you an email and yes, we have all the names you listed and then some.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

kamakeeainaohana — 2009-06-19 20:09:16Z

Kiha is a wahine, Audrene, Kiha is her middle name.

I know previously she gave me persmission to share the information with you.

On another note, I am reading a study on the Laie Plantation and just came upon a name in the document that might interest you, Edie Forsythe. He is describe in an oral history interview as being a type of foreman over the children that worked the plantation.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

kamakeeainaohana — 2009-06-19 19:25:41Z

Well, I read some more of your threads and there has to be a connection here.

My great grandmother is a Nuuhiwa as well and her cousin also married into the Kamakeeaina ohana. So this is very interesting.

Grabell Edwina Hao`e Tilton, marriet Herbert Aina "Bucky" Kamakeeaina, Sr.

Grabell's parents were John Tilson (1912-1998) and M. Cobb-Adams (1917-?).

John's parents were Frank Palaika Tilton (1888-1920) and Anna Ah Chong.

Frank's parent's were Frank Lalio Tilton (1850-1890) and Ester or Ekekal Kaha (1851-1884).

Frank Lalio Tilton's parents were Mr. Tilton (first name unknown) who was born in 1806 and his mother was Kanekapolei Nauku (1810-?).

Kanekapolei Nauku's parents were Nauku (k) and Kahinu Milles Mela (1798-?).

Kanekapolei's parents were Mela (k) and her mother was Kanekapolei (1778-?).

Kanekapolei's parents were Kauakahiakua (k) (1755-?) and her mother was Umiaemoku (w) (1755-?).

I can keep going on, but the line goes about anothe 5-8 generations on either side.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

kamakeeainaohana — 2009-06-18 18:51:17Z

Ae Puanani:

We have spoken before regarding the Tiltons as they tie into my ohana the Kamakeeaina's.

I believe I passed your email address onto my cousin Kiha who's mother is a Tilton.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

kamakeeainaohana — 2009-06-19 20:25:57Z

There were many konohiki of Laiemaloo during Kamehameha III's time, but one that I know if definatively that is linked to our ohana from Laiemaloo is Peni Kealiiwaiwaiole.

Email me at: kamakeeainaohana@yahoo.com

We can continue this conversation there.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

kamakeeainaohana — 2009-06-17 19:21:39Z

I hope after all this time my message finds its way to you.

I have an individual on my tree who carries the name Luukia, where we have also found it listed as Luhia and Luahiwa along with a sister of her's who carries the name Kulaia.

One of this sisters, Luukia was born on the Big Island and Kulaia was born on Oahu. Both were born in the early 1800's, Luukia in 1819 and Kulaia in 1825.

Both of these sisters along with their siblings are listed as having the last name Keliiwaihoikeone.

I would like to discuss a possible link to the individual you are researching as well.

Mahalo;

Kawika Kolomona Kamakeeaina

Samuel, EARL, BEN,Marie,Delvin, Forsyth.* LAKE VIEW CEMETERY, ERIE COUNTY,Pennsylvania,

KENNELLYMARKA — 2009-09-13 03:25:21Z

Delvin W. Forsyth,,, BORN, 1886, DIED, 1954,
........................................................
Marie k, Forsyth, BORN, 1896, DIED, 1981,
............................................................
Samuel B, Forsyth, BORN, 1878, DIED, 1956,
..............................................................
EARL H. Forsyth, BORN, 1889, DIED, 1952,
S.G.T. ---- 486. -- AERO, --- S,Q,D,, -- U.S,
..........................................................
BEN H. Forsyth, BORN, 1876, DIED, 1929,,
,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
ALL OF THES HAVE STONES IN THE FAMILY PLOTT,
AT , LAKE VIEW CEMETERY,
IN ERIE COUNTY,Pennsylvania,
,

1880, Terrance Forsyth,Birth, 1850,Scotland,*Ester Birth,1854,Scotland, ( Elk, Pennsylvania, )

KENNELLYMARKA — 2009-09-13 03:11:04Z

Terrance Forsyth ,
Home in 1880:
Jones, Elk, Pennsylvania .
Age: 30 .
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1850 .
Birthplace: Scotland .
Relation to Head of Household: Self (Head)
Spouse's Name: Ester .
Father's birthplace: Scotland ,
Mother's birthplace: Scotland ,
Occupation: Shoemaker ,
Marital Status: Married Race: White .
Gender: Male,
.......................................................
Ester Forsyth ,
Home in 1880: ,
Jones, Elk, Pennsylvania ,
Age: 26 ,
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1854 ,
Birthplace: Scotland .
Relation to Head of Household: Wife,
Spouse's Name: Terrance ,Forsyth.
Father's birthplace: Scotland .
Mother's birthplace: Scotland .
Occupation: Keeping House ,
Marital Status: Married ,
Race: White .
Gender: Female,
.........................................................
Ama B. Forsyth ,
Home in 1880:,
Jones, Elk, Pennsylvania .
Age: 9 .
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1871 .
Birthplace: Pennsylvania .
Relation to Head of Household: Daughter ,
Father's Name: Terrance ,Forsyth,
Father's birthplace: Scotland ,
Mother's Name: Ester ,
Mother's birthplace: Scotland ,
Marital Status: Single .
Race: White ,
Gender: Female,.
..........................................................
Andrew M. Forsyth ,
Home in 1880: .
Jones, Elk, Pennsylvania ,
Age: 7 .
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873 .
Birthplace: Pennsylvania .
Relation to Head of Household: Son .
Father's Name: Terrance ,Forsyth.
Father's birthplace: Scotland .
Mother's Name: Ester,
Mother's birthplace: Scotland ,
Marital Status: Single .
Race: White .
Gender: Male,
.......................................................
Benjam H. Forsyth .
Home in 1880: .
Jones, Elk, Pennsylvania .
Age: 4 .
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1876 .
Birthplace: Pennsylvania .
Relation to Head of Household: Son .
Father's Name: Terrance .Forsyth.
Father's birthplace: Scotland .
Mother's Name: Ester .
Mother's birthplace: Scotland .
Marital Status: Single.
Race: White .
Gender: Male,
.........................................................
Samuel B. Forsyth ,
Home in 1880:.
Jones, Elk, Pennsylvania .
Age: 2 .
Estimated Birth Year: .
abt 1878 .
Birthplace: Pennsylvania .
Relation to Head of Household: Son .
Father's Name: Terrance .Forsyth.
Father's birthplace: Scotland .
Mother's Name: Ester .
Mother's birthplace: Scotland .
Marital Status: Single .
Race: White .
Gender: Male,
.........................................................

Terrance & Ester Forsyth, Scotland Irland,* and, Erie, county Pennsylvania, *1900,

KENNELLYMARKA — 2009-09-13 02:50:49Z

Ter* Forsyth
[Terance Forsyth,
Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 51 Birth Date: Sep 1848 Birthplace: Irland
[Ireland] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Male Immigration Year: 1881 Relationship to Head of House: Head Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Birthplace: Irland Spouse's Name: Ester Marriage year: 1870 Marital Status: Married Years Married: 30 Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
....................................
Ester Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 46 Birth Date: Aug 1853 Birthplace: Irland
[Ireland] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Female Immigration Year: 1881
[1885] Relationship to Head of House: Wife Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Birthplace: Irland Mother: number of living children: 9 Mother: How many children: 11 Spouse's Name: Ter* Marriage year: 1870 Marital Status: Married Years Married: 30 Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
............................................
Ana B Forsyth
[Arra B Forsyth] Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 29 Birth Date: Mar 1871 Birthplace: At Sea Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Female Relationship to Head of House: Daughter Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
....................................................
Andrew M Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 26 Birth Date: Jun 1873 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Male Relationship to Head of House: Son Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
.......................................................
Bengman H Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 24 Birth Date: Feb 1876 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Male Relationship to Head of House: Son Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
......................................................
Samuel B Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 22 Birth Date: Mar 1878 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Male Relationship to Head of House: Son Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
........................................................
Ella Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 19 Birth Date: Jan 1881 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Female Relationship to Head of House: Daughter Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania.
.......................................................
Willam D Forsyth
[William D Forsyth] Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 14 Birth Date: Jan 1886 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Male Relationship to Head of House: Son Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
........................................................
Earl H Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 10 Birth Date: Jul 1889 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Male Relationship to Head of House: Son Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
............................................................
Perl M Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 10 Birth Date: Jul 1889 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Female Relationship to Head of House: Daughter Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,
........................................................
Ester J Forsyth Home in 1900: Spring Creek, Elk, Pennsylvania Age: 5 Birth Date: Nov 1894 Birthplace: Penn
[Pennsylvania] Race: White Ethnicity: American Gender: Female Relationship to Head of House: Daughter Father's Name: Ter* Father's Birthplace: Irland Mother's Name: Ester Mother's Birthplace: Irland Marital Status: Single Residence : Spring Creek Township, Elk, Pennsylvania,.
.............................................................

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 21:19:06Z

Wow!

Aloha, Puanani

No more phony names. This is my real name.

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 21:17:15Z

1. Kiha is a wahine, Audrene, Kiha is her middle name.

Response: Audrene Kiha most likely comes from our line, the Frank Lalio Tilton line. But then again, she may come from the Leander Kahalewai Tilton line. The William Tilton, II line had no keiki according to my kupuna chart.

2.I know previously she gave me persmission to share the information with you.

Response: Feel free to tell me what information she may be searching for. I may have it.

3. On another note, I am reading a study on the Laie Plantation and just came upon a name in the document that might interest you, Edie Forsythe. He is describe in an oral history interview as being a type of foreman over the children that worked the plantation.

Response: Yes, Edie is from the George Forsyth line; George Forsyth is brother of my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf. I do not know much about Edie.

Aloha, Puanani

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 21:51:02Z

Outstanding; then she is a Ohana line cousin of mine. Terrific, Puanani

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 18:13:32Z

Wish I could help you, but other than a court document that proves that my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf, and her sibling (George Forsyth) both shared in the estate of great great great grandpa, Thomas Charles Forsyth....I know nothing of her sibling, George.

My Ohana cousins directly related to George do not tell me much about this great great grand uncle of mine. I do not know if he was a full or a half sibling to grandma Alice.

Will keep your needs in mind if I find out anything on my own.

Aloha, Puanani Tilton Matsumoto

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 18:04:12Z

What do you need to know? Thomas Charles Forsyth was my great great great grandfather. This has been proved with documents.

He was married, then divorced to Luahiwa Kulaia/Kulaiwa Forsyth. He charged adultery on her part with a Pohaku. Others say he was no more true to his marriage vows.

I presently need/search for proof that Luahiwa was either my biological great great great grandmother, or merely the wife of my grandfather while he had my great great grandmother with another mystery woman.

I have received permission from my own parents to search for such Truths once they had died and I was economically stable and retired. Such is the case today. Hence, I push on "full steam."

I have also received permission from my Ohana cousin, Luahiwa, to pursue the matter in the search for her Truth as well as my own.

Sincerely, Puanani Tilton Matsumoto

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 17:57:04Z

Or ask Kiha permission for me to know his mother's Tilton name?

If possible?

Aloha, Puanani Tilton

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 17:54:31Z

Can you give me that information again on Kiha and the Tilton mother? I do not recall such. Aloha, Puanani

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 17:47:16Z

One correction of an earlier comment by me. Thomas Charles Forsyth is my great great great grandfather. Three greats, not just two.

Puanani Matsumoto

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 21:07:42Z

Thank you. I have a big chart handed me by mom, dad, and kupuna aunts that give me a great/big view of the Tiltons. If Audrene Kiha would trust me with her mother's Tilton name, I could then locate her on my charts and tell you all exactly which Tilton line she comes from. In other words, can she trace her self, to her Tilton mom, to mom's Tilton father? William Tilton and Kanekapolei Miller Mela Nauku had three sons- Frank Lalio Tilton, I.....William Tilton, II....and Leander Kahalewai Tilton.

My email is lucasta@earthlink.net if you do not want this information on the website. I know the major children coming from William Tilton and Kanekapolei Miller Mela Nauku. I also know the major children coming from this couple's three sons.

If not, that is ok, too. I know how private the Tiltons are. The only reason I am no longer as private as earlier, is because my parents told me to tell others what I could share, as soon as I deemed it wise to do so. They were great believers that God is Truth; Truth is Golden, and Jesus wants us to be Truthful.

The problem is: It is difficult for us humans to be sure just what is Truth. Hence, I work actively with several Ohana cousins to get at the Truth, to dare to read other ohana truths, to do more research and then share newly-discovered assertions, beliefs and truths.

Our kupuna deliberately kapu'd the genealogy for us after Alika Mela Junior and Kahinu Miller Mela Nauku. We could go no further into the past for many generations. Ficticious names seem to have been added on charts, to hide facts that might make keiki ashamed of their ancestors.

Today? We are not worried about shame, for our ancestors lived in a time when what they did was religiously and spiritually and politically acceptable. My chart also shows names to mislead the untrained. I search for documents of any and all types to discern what is truth and what is not. Jesus Lord has been good in my search.

What was told the missionaries was not what was passed down to the living descendants today.

Aloha, Puanani

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 21:05:02Z

Thank you. I have a big chart handed me by mom, dad, and kupuna aunts that give me a great/big view of the Tiltons. If Audrene Kiha would trust me with her mother's Tilton name, I could then locate her on my charts and tell you all exactly which Tilton line she comes from.

My email is lucasta@earthlink.net if you do not want this information on the website. I know the major children coming from William Tilton and Kanekapolei Miller Mela Nauku. I also know the major children coming from this couple's three sons.

If not, that is ok, too. I know how private the Tiltons are. The only reason I am no longer as private as earlier, is because my parents told me to tell others what I could share, as soon as I deemed it wise to do so. They were great believers that God is Truth; Truth is Golden, and Jesus wants us to be Truthful.

The problem is: It is difficult for us humans to be sure just what is Truth. Hence, I work actively with several Ohana cousins to get at the Truth, to dare to read other ohana truths, to do more research and then share newly-discovered assertions, beliefs and truths.

Our kupuna deliberately kapu'd the genealogy for us after Alika Mela Junior and Kahinu Miller Mela Nauku. We could go no further into the past for many generations. Ficticious names seem to have been added on charts, to hide facts that might make keiki ashamed of their ancestors.

Today? We are not worried about shame, for our ancestors lived in a time when what they did was religiously and spiritually and politically acceptable. My chart also shows names to mislead the untrained. I search for documents of any and all types to discern what is truth and what is not. Jesus Lord has been good in my search.

What was told the missionaries was not what was passed down to the living descendants today.

Aloha, Puanani

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 20:49:26Z

Yes, and all this for me (and perhaps for you) can be "locked down" by the Great Mahele page in the State Archives. Walk into that building on the right back side of Iolani Palace, and ask for the Black Binder on the Great Mahele. Look up "Alika Mela, konohiki" during Kamehameha III's reign. He is my great great great grandfather. He is junior. His dad is Alexander Miller, aka....Alike Miller Mela, Senior...married to Kanekapolei. And a few minutes ago I read some websites where at least two claimed that this same man, my great great great great grandpa not only married Kanekapolei, but also Elizabeth Kaahumanu? This is the christian name of Queen Kaahumanu! If this is true, proof must be found or the ohana lines claiming such might discomfort Native Hawaiians. I have so warned my cousin webmasters and Kanaka Maoli relatives in general.

Specifically:

1. "My great grandmother is a Nuuhiwa as well and her cousin also married into the Kamakeeaina ohana. So this is very interesting."

Response: From my research, I have come to believe that Nuuhiwa is code for the Hawaiians that came originally from the Marquesas. Do you know any such? Or the society islands? Or Tahiti? For me it means the Hawaiians before Paao and the alii took over. What do you know?

2. Grabell Edwina Hao`e Tilton, marriet Herbert Aina "Bucky" Kamakeeaina, Sr.

Response: Grebell is my cousin; her dad, John Tilton, was the younger brother of my father, Frank Alana Kini Tilton, IV.

3. Grabell's parents were John Tilson (1912-1998) and M. Cobb-Adams (1917-?).

Response: John Tilton and Margaret Cobb-Adams. Their home in Kaneohe was center of Tilton Clan and parties.

4. John's parents were Frank Palaika Tilton (1888-1920) and Anna Ah Chong.

Response: Grandma's name was Anna Alana Achong/Ah Chong. Family knew her as Alana; census knew her as Anna.

5. Frank's parent's were Frank Lalio Tilton (1850-1890) and Ester or Ekekal Kaha (1851-1884).

Response: Frank Lalio Tilton was my great grandfather; Ester Ekekela Kaha was my great grandmother. Ester/Esther's parents were Kaha (k) and Kaie (w).

6. Frank Lalio Tilton's parents were Mr. Tilton (first name unknown) who was born in 1806 and his mother was Kanekapolei Nauku (1810-?).

Response: Great great grandpa's first name was William who came from the Azores, Portugal....specifically from the Island of Flores. I have document to prove this. He was, as far as we can tell/guess/infer....English, Flemish at least. Type "William Tilton Portuguese immigrant" on any search engine, and you will find he married Kanekapolei. This was my great great grandmother, Kanekapolei Miller Mela Nauku, also known as Bessie Kanekai Tilton. They married around 1845; first, William became a naturalized citizen of the monarchy. I have proof of this. Then he was allowed to marry great great grandma.

7. Kanekapolei Nauku's parents were Nauku (k) and Kahinu Milles Mela (1798-?).

Response: That depends on whose website/document you believe. We believe that Kanekapolei Miller Mela Nauku was the stepdaughter and community-acclaimed "daughter" of Mr. Nauku, spouse of Kahinu Miller Mela, daughter of Alexander Miller...aka Alika Miller Mela, Senior to Ali'i Chiefess Kanekapolei with permission of King Kamehameha I and his prime minister, Kalanimoku.

8. Kanekapolei's parents were Mela (k) and her mother was Kanekapolei (1778-?).

Response: Kanekapolei Miller Mela Nauku Tilton's parents were siblings- Alika Mela Miller, Junior.....and Kahinu Miller Mela Nauku. Kahinu's and Alika's mother was Kanekapolei (1753-?)...conceived with "the haole" Alika Miller Mela, Sr...aka Alexander Miller. Hence both Alika Junior and Kahina were Hapa Haole/Hapa Hawaiian.

9. Kanekapolei's parents were Kauakahiakua (k) (1755-?) and her mother was Umiaemoku (w) (1755-?).

Response: Ali'i Chiefess Kanekapolei was mate/wife of Kalaniopu'u and King Kamehameha I in his youth. Have found a claim that she was also the early wife of Kahekili. Am not totally believing of this one, cause I need one more source.

This ali'i chiefess comes from the union of Maui Prince Kauakahiakua 'o lono and Princess Umiaemoku. Umiaemoku's dad was Mo'i of the Mahi in Kohala, named/known as Mahiololi. Prince Kauakahiakua 'o Lono came from the marriage of prince Lono-Maka-Honua and Chiefess Kapoohiwi of Kalae, Molokai.

Prince Lono-Maka-Honua comes from the marriage of Prince Lono-Honua-Kini with Chiefess Kaumakinilani.

10. I can keep going on, but the line goes about anothe 5-8 generations on either side.

Response: Yes. Aloha, dear Ohana cousin.

Love from Lucas (Lu) Leotha Puanani (Nani) Tilton, Mrs. CDSC Matsumoto

known in retirement as Puanani Tilton Matsumoto

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-19 20:12:15Z

Yes, and all this for me and perhaps for your can be locked down by the Great Mahele page in the State Archives. Walk into that building on the right back side of Iolani Palace, and ask for the Black Binder on the Great Mahele. Look up Alika Mela, konohiki during Kamehameha III's reign.

Specifically:

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-18 15:28:09Z

My great great great grandmother (by government documents: divorce records; probate records; baptismal records, and so forth) was Luahiwa Kulaia/Kulaiwa (Nuuhiwa) Forsyth. However, a cousin (who was also named Luahiwa and lives on the mainland) seems to feel that this Luahiwa is not my biological grandmother...only hers, because Luahiwa was just married to my great great great grandfather, Thomas Charles Forsyth. I just want the Truth, if that is possible.

Notes from another cousin tells us that my Luahiwa cousin most likely was named after Luahiwa Kulaia/Kulaiwa Forsyth, and that her biolgical mom was Luahiwa's sister, not Luahiwa herself. For you see....we both, loving cousins, have a deep interest in the Truth- whatever it is.

The awful thing that happened in the 19th century that caused negativity to creep into the cousin lines was that my great great great grandfather, Thomas, divorced Luahiwa for adultery- a charge which must have seemed ludicrous to those who believed that Thomas himself had relations with women while married to Luahiwa.

On our side, we would like to believe that grandpa Thomas would not take grandma Luahiwa to court on adultery, if he was also guilty of adultery in the making of my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf. But we know from history that humans can do just that: accuse their spouse of a sin that they will not accept, while committing the same kind of sin to the sanctity of the marriage. What is good for oneself, might not be good for one's wife, if one was bent on protecting his legal position with a western-dominated government on Maui.

Thomas was divorcing his wife, to protect his name/estate from being claimed by Luahiwa's children by other men- especially one by the name of Pohaku. As a result, there are only two children who were accepted by the court as official/legal keiki of this grandfather, Thomas- my great great grandmother, Alice Forsyth Metcalf, and her brother...George Forsyth. Both inherited their share of grandpa's estate.

Net result: Grandpa hurt other children of great great great (?) grandma Luahiwa, whose descendants today still claim grandpa Thomas as their ancestor per mormon, self-made, oral history type records/forms. I think it is a compliment and welcome all such descendants, for the Hawaiian of yesterday were not as exclusive as the westerners; all keiki were loved and accepted as children of the ohana. Look at Kamehameha I and Pauli Kaoleioku....both related to my Tilton line by marriage or blood.

We all must continue in our research to find the real/true Luahiwa.

Her great great great granddaughter until someone proves convincingly that I am not......
Puanani Matsumoto

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

LeothaLani — 2009-06-18 14:56:52Z

Wow! Everything researcher says seems to be "in the ball park" of what we are researching on Luahiwa Forsyth. But I am not sure, for the information is precious but totally new to me.

These could have been the names that were hidden to protect our Forsyth "Luahiwa." Uncle did tell me that Uncle Adam K. Forsyth said, the information had been kapu'd. I am assuming that we have yet not met the genealogist who had been trained to know the Truth. So all we can do is continue our research.

A similar situation occurred with my dad's line to hide the Kanekapolei/ Alexander marriage from the world and us. Only those who tried to hide our Kanaka Maoli grandmother for the Miller/Mela/Tiltons.... did not reckon with the Great Mahele record, the Portuguese genealogists, the University professor, Mr. Knowlton...or my kupuna who left a chart for me with my mom's documenting....help. They trusted her because she had been a legal secretary.

Mom and dad used the chart to train me over many years. Then they allowed me to keep the chart, but I was not to show it to anyone as the chart was my legacy- no one else, because I had been trained...no one else.

Combining all those references together, my entire genealogy for the Tiltons emerged, and I then saw which names had been added to confuse the stranger/uninitiated/untrained. Mom and dad trained me for a period from my 11th year of age to age 40.

What was hidden that might make life impossible for the keiki? A sacred pio marriage, when such was considered abomination by the missionaries. A common foreign marriage when such was not good for the historic image of one of the most well-known ali'i chiefesses. And so forth.

Too bad none of us was left with a Godfrey/Forsyth/Metcalf chart. Without such, we are still in the midst of the Kapu practices of our ancestors, possibly. Mom said they hid things to protect the Keiki from ridicule by the American world.

That is why mom and dad gave me, and only me, permission for the Ontai/Tiltons....to unlock the Truths by research and print/tell whatever I felt was necessary...but only once they were dead and I was retired.

Love, Cousin Puanani

Re: Thomas Forsyth - Hawaii

Keoki_K — 2009-06-18 02:43:40Z

I'm doing some work on this family line can you let me know that if the information you have that you and me can work together Thank You.

Re: Forsyth

janforsyth_1 — 2009-06-28 10:13:22Z

Not sure whether I can help you, but, my James Forsyth married Mary Whannell of Craigbraes, somewhere in 1820's. Had a son James born 1826 and possibly another, John born 1828. Jan in Australia

looking for kin of John Forsyth

burlbrooks6972 — 2009-05-31 16:17:25Z

John was born in 1788, in Ballymageogh parish of Morne, county down Ireland.

Re: Anyone Related???

fn3js — 2009-07-07 03:22:11Z

My grandfather was Frank G. Forsyth and married Dorothy Chapman. Passed away in the late 60's.