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Hawthorn(e)s of Down, Ireland

Hawthorn(e)s of Down, Ireland

Posted: 14 Apr 2001 8:58PM GMT
Edited: 23 Jun 2001 12:06AM GMT
Hans (Sarah Ward), Patrick (Selena Downey), John(Margaret Wilson), James(Agnes Laird), Sarah(James Laird), Adam(Mary Church), Archibald(Charlotte Howard), Peter Hawthorn, William(Mary Boyce),Adam(Sarah Hannah),Ann(William Vincent), Margaret(William Carson)...all Hawthorns were from County Down, Ireland. Some of these, Peter, Archibald, Hans, Patrick, John, James, and Adam ended up in Anderston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland. Hans and Patrick emigrated to Canada in 1847. Another brother may have as well.

Hawthorns

Posted: 17 Apr 2001 4:06PM GMT
Edited: 22 Jun 2001 11:28AM GMT
Dear Terry,

I performed a search for all the Hawthorn clan and their various husbands and or wives at the Mormon's website at www.familysearch.org, and came up with the entries you will see below.

Your message did not state relations between the many Hawthorns you listed, so I am assuming that Hans and Sarah Ward were the progenitors of many of the Down Hawthorns listed below them.

Hans HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Event(s):
Birth: 1799
Down, Ireland

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Sarah WARD

No source was given for the birth entry of Hans

_______________________________


Hans HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Sarah WARD
Marriage: 5 Aug 1826
Presbyterian, Killinchy, Down, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch numbers: M700301
Film number: 0824373 IT 4
Film number: 0823877 IT 6
Printout call number: 0883755

The Mormon's batch numbers just refer back to the same entry as you see
above. Film number 0824373 IT 4, refers to the information below:

Killinchy Parish Church : baptisms, 1820-1877, marriages, 1825-1844 and
burials, 1831-1876 and Killinchy Presbyterian Church, list of baptisms and
marriages, 1812- 1845
Authors: Mettam, Z. (Zara K.) (Main Author)

Also on microfilm. Salt Lake City : Filmed by the Genealogical Society of
Utah, 1971. on 1 microfilm reel ; 35 mm.
Microfilm number: 823877 Item 6

The second microfilm number you can order from the Family History Center for
this entry concerns the following information:

Killinchy Presbyterian Church : list of births 1835-1900, list of marriages
1835 to 1845
Authors: Stewart, David (Main Author)
Mettam, Z. (Zara K.) (Added Author)
Killinchy Presbyterian Church (Down) (Added Author)

Also on microfilm. Salt Lake City : Filmed by the Genealogical Society of
Utah, 1971. on 1 microfilm reel ; 35 mm.
824373 Item 4

While the third printout call number will have information from the
following source:

Parish register printouts of Killinchy, Down, Ireland, (Presbyterian
Church), marriages, 1812-1845
Authors: Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Genealogical
Department (Main Author)

Parish register printouts of Killinchy, Down, Ireland, (Presbyterian
Church), marriages, 1812-1845 FHL BRITISH Film
883755 Item 2

Printout usually give less information than the records by searching the "Film numbers."

_________________________________


The daughter of Hans and Sarah born in Lanark:

Sarah HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Christening: 25 May 1840
Barony, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: Hans HAWTHORN
Mother: Sarah WARD

Source Information:

Batch number: C119667
Film number: 6901464

Microfilm number 6901464 is an index that will lead you to the parish
register microfilms extent from 1672-1854, for the Church of Scotland,
Barony, in Glasgow. The actual microfilm that Sarah's birth will be found
in, according to the on-line record is 1041479, which contains the following
information:

v. 10. Baptisms, 1838-1841 v. 11. Baptisms, 1841-1842 v. 12. Baptisms,
1843-1846

If you would like all the other microfilm numbers for baptisms and
marriages for this parish, please visit your local Family History Center and look up this record. More on how to access records at your local center can be found later in this email.

The Batch number for Sarah's baptism gives the same information as you see
in the record for her above.

I also found children of Hans and Sarah born in Ontario, Canada. Their
entries follow:

Agnes HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Birth: 1843
Bruce, Ontario

Parents:
Father: Hans HAWTHORN
Mother: Sarah WARD
____________________________________

Margaret HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Birth: 1846
Bruce, Ontario

Parents:
Father: Hans HAWTHORN
Mother: Sarah WARD

No source or microfilm numbers were found for either birth. These entries
are especially suspect because the source is not given.
________________________________________

PATRICK HAWTHORN

I could find no baptism certificate for Patrick, but his record of baptism,
and hopefully the names of the his parents (if not Hans and Sarah) will be found in the Killinchy Church of Ireland registers, film number 0824373 IT 4.

But I did find his marriage entry to Selina Downey, in the parish of
Killyleah, Down:

Patrick HAWTHORNE
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Selina DOWNEY
Marriage: 24 Mar 1847
Presbyterian, Killyleagh, Down, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch number: M700311
Film number: 0928510 IT 1
Printout call number: 0883748

Microfilm number 0928510 IT 1, refers to the Killyleah parish registers of
baptisms between 1835-1881 and marriages between the years 1835-1871.

However, I book I have by Brian Mitchell called A Guide To Irish Parish
Registers shows that the Parish of Killyleah for the Church of Ireland has
registers that go back to 1813, while the registers for the First
Presbyterian Parish of Killyleah goes back to 1693 and the Second
Presbyterian Parish of Killyleah to1840, respectively.

From that information, it appears the Mormons most likely filmed the
registers for the First Presbyterian Parish, with registers available from
1693. If that is true, these registers may also have the baptism entries for
both Patrick and Selina, the marriages of their parents, the baptisms of
their parents, as so on back in time to 1693, if indeed they were all from that parish originally.

You can write to the minister for the church and ask if he can research the
baptisms of Patrick Hawthorne and Selina Downey, and perhaps the marriage
and baptisms of their parents.

You can address your letter:

Presbyterian Minister,
Parish of Killyleah,
County Down, Northern Ireland

Northern Ireland has a post code, similar to an American Zip Code, but the
letter should get there without it. Or you can try to find the post code for
Killyleah on line.

The government in Ireland began to keep records of marriages for Protestants
only, starting in1845, which means there should be a civil record of the
marriage of Patrick and Selina in the District Council Office, in
Downpatrick.

But the parish register of the marriage will most likely give you more
information than the civil record, as the parish records sometimes list the
parents of the bride and groom, and also who the sponsors, or godparents
were.

If you would like information on how to obtain a civil registration records however,
please email.

The Mormon site did not list any children for Patrick and Selina either in
Ireland, Scotland, or Canada. But if you believe the couple moved to
Scotland before they had children, check the microfilm for parish registers,
Barony, Lanark, Scotland, mentioned for Sarah's baptism, or you can also
search the parish registers of Killyleah for the baptisms of any of the
children.

Concerning John Hawthorn: I could find no records of
birth in Down for John Hawthorn as a search for a birth or baptism record
is useless without the names of their parents, especially their mothers'
maiden names, though I did search. You may want to look in the Killinchy and
Killyleah microfilms for their baptismal information. If John was the son of Hans and Sarah, his baptism record may be found in the Killinchy microfilm.

But I did find they got married in Lanark, Scotland. Their marriage entry is
below:

John HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Margaret WILSON
Marriage: 21 Jun 1840
Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Source Information:

Batch number: M119754
Film number: 1042942
Film number: 1042988
Printout call number: 6902528

Film number 1042942, is the from the "Old parochial registers, 1612-1854,"
for the Church of Scotland in Glasgow. This is a microfilm of marriages. The
microfilm number 1042988 refers to an index of what are known as "Blotter registers" which contain a "Microfilm of original records located in the New Register House, Edinburgh. Records include some baptisms and marriage proclamations performed outside the city of Glasgow and contains a few Non-Conformist records of the same."

The microfilm number for the marriage proclamations for 1839-1840 is 994190, and for 1840-1842 it is microfilm number 994191.

There are several more microfilm numbers associated with this marriage entry which you can look up at your local Family History Library, by accessing the library's microfiche, or the in-house data base's International Genealogical Index or IGI as it is known. All of the records concerning the Hawthorn in this email were found using the IGI.

The Printout call number, microfilm 6902528 will give no more information
than what is listed in the other films mentioned above.

I also did a search for any children of John and Margaret, and found there
are four listings for them on the familysearch website. Those entries
follow:

Jane HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Birth: 20 Nov 1842
Barony, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: John HAWTHORN
Mother: Margaret WILSON

Source Information:

Batch number: C119668
Microfilm number: 1041479
Printout number: 6901464

We've seen the microfilm number, 1041479, for the 1840 baptism of Sarah
Hawthorn, Barony, Lanark, Scotland. The Batch and Printout numbers for Jane
will give no more information than what you see for the entry.

The other children are as follows:

Robert HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Event(s):
Birth: 26 May 1845
Barony, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: John HAWTHORN
Mother: Margaret WILSON

Source Information:

Batch number: C119669
Film number: 1041479
Printout number: 6901464

____________________________________

The next two children appear to have been born in a different section of Glasgow:

Margaret HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Birth: 27 Mar 1855
Milton, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: John HAWTHORN
Mother: Margaret WILSON

Source Information:

Batch number: C119281
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

The explanation for this record and what the microfilm contains for it, is
below:

Register of births, marriages and deaths of Scotland
Authors: Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Family History
Library (Salt Lake City, Utah) (Main Author)

Also on microfiche. Salt Lake City : Filmed by the Genealogical Society of
Utah, 1988. 3 microfiches ; 11 X 15 cm.
Microfilm number: 6035516

_______________________________________

Jane HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Birth: 30 Jan 1858
Milton, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: John HAWTHORN
Mother: Margaret WILSON

Source Information:

Batch number: C119281
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

Because this is the second daughter the couple had by the name of Jane, I am
assuming the first Jane, baptized in 1842, had died.

The microfilm number 6035516 is the same as the one for Margaret. But
according to the record, the film also contains records of deaths as well.
You may want to not only search for the baptism record of Jane born in 1858,
but also the death record of her older sister with the same first name, who
died at some as yet unknown date. I could not find a death record of the
older Jane at the site.

I could not find a record of baptism for James Hawthorn in Down, but I did
find a record of his marriage with Agnes Laird. That information follows:

James HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Agnes LAIRD
Marriage: 1 Jan 1866
Anderston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Source Information:

Batch number: M119311
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

Notice that the microfilm number is the same as that for the two previous
baptism entries for Margaret and Jane Hawthorn.

In addition I located a baptism record of one child. That entry is below:

James HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Event(s):
Birth: 5 Jun 1866
Anderston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: James HAWTHORN
Mother: Agnes LAIRD

Source Information:

Batch number: C119311
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

You are of course familiar with that microfilm number above. Having multiple
entries with the same microfilm number will make any subsequent research a
lot easier.

_________________________________________


The familysearch site had about 10 entries for baptisms of a Sarah
Hawthorn, but without knowing who her parents are, it would be impossible to
tell which one is the Sarah you are interested in. Of the 10 entries none
were for baptism in Killinchy or Killyleah.

But I did locate her marriage record to James Laird. That follows. The
spelling in the entry is original to the record:

Sarah HAWTHORNE
Sex: F

Marriage(s):
Spouse: James LAIRD
Marriage: 1843
Presbatyrian, Boardmills, Down, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch number: 9019430, Sheet 5
Film number: 1553799

The microfilm number 1553799 is from Mormon "Patron sheets," which will give
you no further information, but which tells me this couple, or some of their
descendents had joined the Mormon Church. This caused me to search for a
record of their children not only in Ireland and Scotland, but also in North
America, where Joseph Smith founded the Mormon Church in Fayette, New York,
in 1830.

But I could find no records of children born to the couple in any of those
three places. As for Boardmills, Mitchell's book notes how this Presbyterian
parish (I also believe it is a town) is in the Civil Parish of Killaney. The
Presbyterian registers for the First Presbyterian Church go back to 1782,
while the registers for the Second Presbyterian Church are extent from 1846.

The microfilm number for the parish registers of the First Presbyterian
Church, combined with registers of the Second Presbyterian Church is 823750
Item 1. A brief explanation of the microfilm records and the location of
Boardmills, Down, is below:

Contents: Births, 1782-1889, with Second Boardmills baptisms, 1856-1866 [1
page only, with 2 marriages] -- Marriages 1782-1844 -- Irregular marriages
1784-1842.

Boardmills was a village in Killaney Parish, 5 miles southeast of Lisburn
with a post office under Lisburn.

___________________________________

I could find no baptism record for Adam Hawthorn, but did find the marriage
record for him and Sarah Hannah, which follows:

Adam HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Sarah HANNAH
Marriage: 1 Jun 1818
Dromore Parish, Down, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch number: M700051
Film number: 0496515 IT 6, vol 1
Printout call number: 0883747

The film number 0496515 IT 6 of this marriage entry indicates that the
couple was married in the Church of Ireland. However, in his book about
parish registers, Mitchell mentions that many Presbyterian records were kept
by the Church of Ireland, as indeed were Roman Catholic entries, until these
denominations set up their own parishes. The Presbyterian parishes for Dromore, according to Mitchell's book, weren't in existence until 1851 and 1857.

The information about the film number is below:

Dromore Parish Church, County Down, Northern Ireland, [church registers,
1784-1873]
Church of Ireland. Cathedral Church of Christ the Redeemer (Dromore, Down)

Typescript.

Contents: v. 1. Baptisms, births, 1784-1834 -- v. 2. Births, 1833-1871,
marriages, 1784-1845, burials, 1784-1873.

The Church of Ireland parish church for Dromore was the Cathedral Church of
Christ the Redeemer.

I found one child born to Adam and Sarah in the parish. Her baptism entry
follows:

Mary HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Birth: 7 Mar 1819
Dromore Parish, Down, Ireland

Parents:
Father: Adam HAWTHORN
Mother: Sarah HANNAH

Source Information:

Batch number: C700051
Film number: 0496515 IT 6

This film number is the same as the marriage record of her parents. I could
find no listing of children born in Scotland.

I found the marriage entry for Archibald Hawthorn and Charlotte Howard, but
could not locate a baptism or birth record for him. Below is his marriage
record.

Archibald HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Charlotte HOWARD
Marriage: 9 Jan 1853
St. Andrews And St. Leonards, Fife, Scotland

Source Information:

Batch number: M119536
Microfilm number: 1040181 IT 1

The microfilm number gives the following information about the registers.

Authors: Church of Scotland. Parish Church of St. Andrews (Main Author)
Church of Scotland. Parish Church of St. Leonards (Added Author)

Baptisms, Marriages (St. Leonards) 1820-1855; Neglected Entries (Baptisms -
St. Andrews) 1844-1845 . Another microfilm copy. Salt Lake City : Filmed by
the Genealogical Society of Utah, 1951. -- 9 microfilm reels ; 35 mm

The baptism of their son Archibald is next:

Archibald HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Event(s):
Birth: 16 Jul 1855
Anderston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: Archibald HAWTHORN
Mother: Charlotte HOWARD

Source Information:

Batch number: C119311
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

And of course you have already seen this film number for the register of
births, marriages and deaths of Scotland, listed earlier in this email.

The same microfilm number will also include the marriage of Adam Hawthorn
and Mary Church:

Adam HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Mary CHURCH
Marriage: 15 Aug 1864
Blythswood, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Source Information:

Batch number: M119271
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

Likewise with second the Adam you mentioned in your message, I could not
locate his specific baptism record, not knowing who his parents were.

But I did locate several children born to Adam and Mary:

Annie HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Event(s):
Birth: 19 Feb 1866
Anderston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: Adam HAWTHORN
Mother: Mary CHURCH

Source Information:

Batch number: C119311
Film number: 6035516

___________________________________


Samuel HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Event(s):
Birth: 3 Jun 1867
Milton, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: Adam HAWTHORN
Mother: Mary CHURCH

Source Information:

Batch number: C119281
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

______________________________________


James HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Event(s):
Birth: 10 Jan 1871
Milton, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: Adam HAWTHORN
Mother: Mary CHURCH

Source Information:

Batch number: C119281
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

____________________________________


William HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Event(s):
Birth: 14 Feb 1873
Milton, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland

Parents:
Father: Adam HAWTHORN
Mother: Mary Louisa CHURCH

Source Information:

Batch number: C119281
Film number: 6035516 REGISTER

This last birth entry shows Mary Church's middle name was Louisa.

________________________________________

For the marriage of William Hawthorn, I found he married Mary Boyce in
County Antrim, which is the next county over from Down:

William HAWTHORN
Sex: M

Marriage(s):
Spouse: Mary BOYCE
Marriage: 4 May 1822
Ballymoney, Antrim, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch number: 8934610, Sheet 26
Film number: 1553616

This microfilm number is for Patron sheets submitted to the Mormon church by
a member of the Mormons.

Unfortunately I could not locate the records for any of the children of
William hawthorn and Mary Boyce.

Concerning Ann Hawthorn's marriage to William Vincent, I found two entries,
both with conflicting years to one another. More research will have to be
done by looking at the parish registers for the record of this marriage, as
it appears that either the person who transcribed the entry could not read
the date properly, or more than one person made the submission:

Ann HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Marriage(s):
Spouse: William VINCENT
Marriage: 20 Jan 1831
Presbyterian, Killinchy, Down, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch number: M700301
Film number: 0823877 IT 6 Film 0883755 Film
Film number: 0824373 IT 4
Printout call number: 0883755

We saw these same Batch, Film, and Printout numbers for the marriage of Hans
Hawthorn to Sarah Ward for the Killinchy Presbyterian Church, in Down.

_______________________________________

This second marriage entry for Ann and William is from 1837. All the other
information is the same as the first entry:

Ann HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Marriage(s):
Spouse: William VINCENT
Marriage: 20 Jan 1837
Presbyterian, Killinchy, Down, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch number: M700301
Film number: 0823877 IT 6
Film number: 0824373 IT 4
Printout call number: 0883755

No children were found on-line for Ann and William.

_______________________________________


Margaret HAWTHORN
Sex: F

Marriage(s):
Spouse: William CARSON
Marriage: 9 Nov 1833
Dromore Parish, Down, Ireland

Source Information:

Batch number: M700051
Film number: 0496515 IT 6

The information about the marriage entry for Margaret Hawthorn and William Carson was from the following source

Dromore Parish Church, County Down, Northern Ireland, [church registers, 1784-1873]

Vol. 1. FHL US/CAN Film
496515 Item 6

You may want to also check film number 496515 Item 6 and film number 496723 Item 3 for any children born to this couple in Dromore, as no entries for their children could be found on-line.

This register is from the Church of Ireland, Dromore Parish Church, which could also have early 1800 Presbyterian records as well.

Conspicuously absent from this research were the birth records of the spouses of the Hawthorns. You could look for their baptism records and the names of their parents at your local Family History Center.

To find the nearest center to you, phone 800-346-6044. You can rent microfilms, which must be kept at the center, for about $3.50 each. But the films can be renewed for an extended period for an additional charge.

As a word of caution, I do not trust on-line information very much, but use records such as those found above, as finding aids, or starting points for particular genealogical information pertaining to locations of births and marriages, and the years of the events. All the information found on line should be checked against copies of original sources, or microfilms, found at your Family History Center.

If you go to the center I recommend checking all those film numbers you see above for their accuracy at the IGI, which can be accessed through the center's own computer data base, or by microfiche. The IGI on the computer will be much more easier to use.

I trust some of this information will be useful to you in further genealogical research of the Hawthorns.

All the best.

Dave Boylan









Posted: 17 Apr 2001 7:17PM GMT
Edited: 23 Jun 2001 12:06AM GMT
Hi Dave-
WOW! Do you want to become one of the family? We could use a good researcher like yourself! Thanks so much. I'll see about ordering the films and see where that takes me! Again, I certainly appreciate all of your wonderful help! Terry

Hawthorn Family

Posted: 17 Apr 2001 7:28PM GMT
Edited: 22 Jun 2001 11:28AM GMT
Dear Terry,

Thank you so much for your kind words, and again good luck in your research with the Hawthorn family.

Very Sincerely,

Dave

Re: Hawthorn(e)s of Down, Ireland

Posted: 13 Jul 2003 1:41AM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 30 Nov 2006 2:16AM GMT
My GGGrandfather Hector Hawthorne came from Ireland to Canada in 1823, He was born about 1770, He had two Sons Robert and Samuel and one Daughter. Searching for his wife's name and his Parents. His wife, Samuel and his Daughter left and went to the New England States in the 1830's, Hector and his son Robertand his wife Elizabeth stayed in Canada.

Re: Hawthorn(e)s of Down, Ireland

Posted: 13 Jul 2003 12:46PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 11 Jun 2006 4:09PM GMT
Hans and his brother, Patrick came over to Canada in about 1846. Hans settled in Greenock, Bruce County and Patrick in Goulbourne Twp, Carleton County, Ontario. Hans was born in 1801, his brother, in 1815. They, and two other brothers,lived in Anderston, Scotland before moving to Canada. The other two brothers stayed in Scotland and died there. Where in Canada was Hector? He would have been more of the age of an uncle if he was related. Hans parents were John and Agnes Cain Hawthorn. He was a shoemaker. Hans was living in Ballygeegon, Down, Ireland when he had his first son. There was also a Joseph Hawthorn who had a son there named Samuel Clelland Hawthorn, who I suspect is his cousin.

Re: Hawthorn(e)s of Down, Ireland

Posted: 13 Jul 2003 11:15PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 30 Nov 2006 2:16AM GMT
Thank you for the information. Hector settled in Charlotte County, New Brunswick. He died 25 Dec 1846. His Son Robert born in Ireland about 1801 died in N.B.1891 Robert's wife Elizabeth Steel Billings born in Ireland died in N.B. 1888. Robert and Elizabeth had six children, David, Margaret, Robert, John william, George Henry,(my Grandfather) and Alexander.
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