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Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 7 Aug 2010 4:31PM GMT
Classification: Query
I'm trying to get a copy of Thomas Stafford's b. 1606 Warwickshire England, complete coat of arms he brought over to Plymouth 1n 1626, which was later given into the family of Col. Jacob/Joab Stafford b. 1729 who married Susan Spencer and lived in or around Warrick Kent, Rhode Island.

It supposendly has the motto, "Virtue the cornerstone of life" on it, as reported in History of the town of Clershire, Berkshire County Massachucettes.

Line is supposedly:
Thomas Stafford 1606-1677 + Elizabeth (?)
Samuel Stafford b. 1636 + Mary Westcott m. 1671
Thomas Stafford 1723-1780 (Brother of Col. Jacob Stafford) + Diademe Carpenter m. 1744
Thomas Stafford b. 1753-1805 Coventry, Kent Rhode Island + Lydia Corey b. 1753-1833
Richard Stafford 1784-1858 Coventry Kent Rhode Island + Sarah (Sally) Ring
This is the Stafford's of Stafford Manor, Boquet, near Essex, New York.

Immediate Grandmother, Ester Stafford.

I'm not really interested in the whole John Rodger Stafford/Elene Earl issue. Just whay it was that Thomas brought over when he stated he was, "of the blood of the Stafford."

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 7 Aug 2010 5:09PM GMT
Classification: Query
I missed one Thomas Stafford, b.1686, Old Warrick, Kent Rhode Island married twice. My ancestor is from the second marriage to Audrey Green m. ~1720.

Thomas Stafford m. Diademe Carpenter, and Col. Joab Stafford m. Susana Spencer were both from this marriage.

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 10 Aug 2010 6:00PM GMT
Classification: Query
I read some great stuff about Joab Stafford fighting at Bedford, and saw a picture of his grave on Stafford Hill.

Through a history book, I learned that the arms were passed down, "Joab handed down the coat-of-arms of the family, and it is now in possession of Mrs. Edward Doolittle of Bergen, NJ." This was in an 1870's book on early settelers.

Anyone have any information?

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 11 Aug 2010 8:03AM GMT
Classification: Query
In Bibliothera Americana, 1886 by Robert Clarke and Company., Cincinnati, there is a reference to a book. PAge 200, 5301 Stafford. A contrbution to the Genecalogy of the Stafford Family in America; containing an Account of Col. Joab Stafford, and a complete Record of his Descendants in the male lines. By Henery Marvin Benedict. Portrait and Illustrations. 8vo. pp. 27, paper uncut. Albany, 1870.

I bet it is in there. Also checking with Bergen NJ historical society for leads.

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 20 Aug 2010 12:14PM GMT
Classification: Query
It is extremely unlikely that a 20-year-old was granted a Coat of Arms by the King.

Coats of Arms were not inherited -- issued to one individual only -- though extremely rarely a wife or son might be granted the privilege of wearing a modified version.

In the unlikely case the rumored coat of arms was genunine, it could be found listed in official English heraldic registers. If not found there, the rumor may have been someone's wish for association with nobility.

Some families did adopt crests (as in modern "logos") for business purposes, but these have nothing to do with Coats of Arms.

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 20 Aug 2010 7:03PM GMT
Classification: Query
I tend to agree, but it does say that in the history.

There seems to be no link between Thomas Stafford and any Stafford that had any noble rank, patents, or lands in England. He was probably related to someone originally from Staffordshire.

I have been over all the likely suspects, and there really are no connection, and most of the supposed links are totally unsubstantiated, and when read through, it will eventually tell that there were no children, or show the children to be other people who went on to do different things. The noble line of the name Stafford appears to have died out in the early to mid. 1700's.

It's great reading though. Being a noble Stafford was almost like a death sentence from 1350 to 1650.

I think that possibly in the 1800's, it was very fad to try and say that you were descended from certain people. I came across the initials belonging to my g.g.g. grandfather in the attic of the house he built in 1820 using the colors red and white, and later my g. grandfather repeated it in red in 1875. It was mainly becuase of this that I wondered if Thomas Stafford had adopted some sort of logo, or family colors.

"Virtue is the cornerstone of life" is a pilgrim/quaker motto popular at the time of the early 1600's.

We should look at the surmaned Staffords who came to the US for what they did here, but it would be nice to know more about the family in England before 1600.

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 26 Aug 2010 7:48PM GMT
Classification: Query
I've gotten one back so far, one I may have already seen before from some stuff my cousin in New Jersy brought by in the 1980's. I traced it back to Ralph of Grafton, 1481, brother of Humphrey. The picture I looked at had no motto and was just the shield.

or chevron gules quarter ermine.

Humphrey at this time used or chevron gules chief azure.

This could have come through the Westbury, Shenly Staffords, who are pretty minor and cadet. There is a whole string of Thomas Staffords in that line, like 8, and they are not shown in most other easy references that can be looked up. It could have been a younger brother of one of these Thomas Staffords, who named his own son Thomas. Or maybe not. From what people say, this may be more likely than I believe.

Going to check this against The Jocob Stafford family material when that comes in.

Thomas Stafford 1606-1677 + Elizabeth (?)
Samuel Stafford b. 1636 + Mary Westcott m. 1671
Thomas Stafford, b.1686, Old Warrick, Kent Rhode Island married twice. My ancestor is from the second marriage to Audrey Green m. ~1720.
Thomas Stafford ~1732-1780 (Brother of Col. Jacob Stafford) + Diademe Carpenter m. 1744
Thomas Stafford b. 1753-1805 Coventry, Kent Rhode Island + Lydia Corey b. 1753-1833
Richard Stafford 1784-1858 Coventry Kent Rhode Island + Sarah (Sally) Ring (built and dated manor house with paint, 1824)
Charles Stafford
Jonathan Stafford (dated initials, 1878)
Ester Stafford (grandmother)

Col. Jacob Stafford fought under Gen. John Stark at the Battle of Bennington, August 16, 1777. He was wounded in the arm.
Lt. Samuel Stafford also fought there with a detatchment of Green Mountain Boys.

Job Stafford (I believe brother of Richard) was wounded at the battle of Boquet River 1814, when a cannonball from a British sloop ricochetted on the slope in from of the bunker fort, and flew toward him. He jumped out of the way, but it ricochetted again off a nearby tree stump and hit him in the leg, the injury forcing him to use a cane for the rest of his life. Survived by the William Morse family.

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 26 Aug 2010 8:22PM GMT
Classification: Query
Thomas Stafford 1722 or 1732? Don't know about that one marriage in there at 1744. Some sites list Thomas as the last child in the family and that Jacob was the first child, some the other way around.

Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 3 Sep 2010 8:54AM GMT
Classification: Query
I shouldn't have put that about Shenly. That would be Ashbury's kids, if they took the name Stafford.

It appears William Stafford (died at 7 Oaks) had a bastard. I had heard about the family maybe coming through him from from another site, then ruled it out, because he only had a daughter.

He bought and willed over a manor at Tattenhoe to this son Thomas. Another book on the county history will say they became squires (a rank one order lower than knight)and owned fields in the area right next to Humphrey's.

I think they lived in Lichfield, because Tattenhoe was just a manor below a ruin. If you find the right history it will talk about the family lands being passed on in the early 1600's to a cousin or brother because the sons of Thomas could not be found.

This sounds a lot more plausible than any other theories I have heard.


Re: Thomas Stafford (1605) Warwickshire, England complete heraldry?

Posted: 14 Sep 2010 12:21AM GMT
Classification: Query
I'm getting the impression it may just be better to say he spontaneously jumped out of a hole in the ground like a dwarf.

There is some indication that the original plaque may have burned in a house fire in the 1930's.

Here is that information I looked at earlier in part:

According to Phillip Stafford, he obtained the following in Dec. 1934 from the New York Genealogical and Biographical Society, 124 E. 56th St., New York City NY from records supplied to the Society by the late Martin H. Stafford of Albany NY:

"Several branches descend from Sir John Stafford who held the manor of Bromshulf, County Stafford, in 1361. He had two sons, Sir Ralph Stafford of Grafton, County Worcester, and Sir Humphrey Stafford of Hook, County Dorset. Thomas Stafford who came to America in 1626 was descended from Sir Ralph Stafford of Grafton. Sir Ralph married Maud, the daughter and heiress of Sir John Hastang of Leamington, County Warwick. Ralph had two sons, Humphrey and John. Humphrey had three sons, John, Humphrey and William. John died without issue. Humphrey and William died in trying to quell Jack Cade's rebellion in 1450. Humphrey had four sons. William had one son, John, from whom Thomas, who came to America, was descended."
He was married to Elizabeth about 1633.17,17
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