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Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Posted: 26 Jun 2007 11:48AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi,
Demont F Morenzy was a ships surgeon out of Liverpool to USA circa 1854-8.
He was born in England and went to USA to qualify as a doctor. He was commisioned as a ships surgeon after he qualified in 1854. Anyone know where I can find a list of ships surgeons, navy or merchant navy? His early life is a mystery. His later life in USA well documented.
Cheers
M Head

Re: Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Posted: 25 Jan 2013 2:54PM GMT
Classification: Query
Surnames: Morenzy, De MontMorency
Hi,

Hope I've got the right person!

I'm a family researcher myself and I happened across your queries over the last few years, reference a person called Morenzy. My understanding is that he was a descendant of the Irish De Montmorency family (County Kilkenny). This was a big widespread well-off aristrocratic family in the late 1700's and early to mid 1800's. They were a junior branch of even older and more aristocratic sister families in Europe and UK. The mainland European branch goes back many centuries, and even in Victorian time their links with the Irish branch were already very weak. Some parts of the early family in Ireland and UK were originally called Morres, and their main estates were at Mount Morres. This was convenient because it enabled them to use the name De Mount Morres to strengthen their dying hold on their De Montmorency name....this slight of hand wasn't universally popular with the family fathers in Europe!
Anyway, back to your search. We understand that a wayward great great aunt of mine (Mary Buggy 1775-1850's)was estate secretary at the family estates near Kilkenny in Ireland. She had an illicit dalliance with the eldest son of the family. He was Sir William(II)Evans Ryves Morres (de Montmorency)(1769-1829). The father (master of the estate)was Sir William(I)Evans Morres. The son's dalliance with Mary(1798-1802)produced 2 (under the bedsheets) offspring: William(III)de Momtmorency and Haydock Morres. Son No 2 Haydock got married twice (both to Catherines, I think) and had offspring in the 1820's. Son no.1, William(III) appeared to have led a slightly roughish and wild early life and managed to spend heavily from his father's dwindling estate. After an unconventional start involving his future wife's abduction he actually managed a marriage (1818)to Harriet Ursula Mossum. There were 3 children William(IV), Harriet Ursula, and Louisa. William(III)himself died in mysterious circumstances in Middlesex, England in 1850. We believe he was fond of the bottle, and probably other things too!! Earlier on when the estate was on its knees, after his father's death he had to rent it all out through agents. One of William's agents was unable to evict Mary Buggy (and her relatives) from the house which had been allowed to live in on the estate. In the 1840's there was a major and scandalous court case over this where all the dirt came out, and Mary won! Eventually Mary went, and the Estate was all sold off to pay William(III)'s debts.
I understand that your man was either William(IV)(from Harriet and William(III)s marriage) or one of the other children from Haydock's marriage. William IV would have been born around 1820. It was known he joined the British army, probably 76th regiment, but fate unknown after that. It was also known that all of William(II)'s children, and grand children, were traumatised and shaken, and perhaps shamed, by their families turn of events and there had been talk of emigration and name changing. It was also known that one family member did actually leave, believed with his wife, for USA under an assumed name Demont Morenzy. There were strong connections with the NE of England and Durham, because the family had cousins there, and also because there were family army connections there.
Hope that helps!

Let me know if can be of any further assistance.

Re: Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Posted: 25 Jan 2013 3:58PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi,
All or most of this info is to be found on queries I and other researchers have been deliberating over for some years, but where do you get the idea from that one member of the family left for USA under the assumed name of Demont Morenzy. What proof is there.
I need proof, perhaps a passenger list.

I would be very keen to know of the source. He did state, on his second marriage certificate that his mother was Letitia Egan and his father William ??
He did not have a wife when he went to USA in 1848 or 1850 as he was only 16 or 18. He married the daughter of the ex mayor of Lancaster city

Do you know where he went to school? He was very well educated and had a classical education so must have been to a public school here in England.
I would be interested to hear your reply to my queries

M Head

Re: Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Posted: 25 Jan 2013 7:00PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi again,
I have gathered my thoughts a little more about Demont Morenzy. Sorry but this will be a long message.
I am doing this research for an ancester of Demont who lives in Pennsylvania.
Demont went to USA in 1848 as on the 1900 USA census
He was born on 20 May 1832 in Durham as on the 1870 USA census
He quaified as a doctor in 1854 from the Philadelphia college of medicine
He married Catherine Rebecca Carpenter in 1855

He says during a court appearance as a witness that he visited England in late 1858 then went to Belfast and worked as doctor there for one year and then went to Liverpool for 6 weeks, not working, then worked on passenger ships as a surgeon for 2 years.
He had 4 sons, one died in infancy and after his wife died in 1876 he moved to Illinois and remarried and had 2 daughters. he died in 1905.

I have drawn up a family tree from your message and ruled out the first two Williams as beig too old or dead to be his father and William 111 who died in 1850 can't be his father either as who was Demont visiting in 1858?
The William 1V is too young to be his father.
Demont also stated that his uncle worked as a visitng physician in the Belfast hospital in 1859.

Who were the Durham relatives??? ..this seems a likely avenue of research.

What school might he have attended in England???

I hope you can answer some of this puzzle...
Thanks
Marianne Head

Re: Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Posted: 25 Jan 2013 7:59PM GMT
Classification: Query
Right, I'll give it a go. I did notice in my research a person of that name 'coming and going' between Ireland, England, and USA/Canada, at about the right time. The person that I noticed also did a stint at a hospital in Northern Ireland.
I'll get back in due course

Re: Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Posted: 26 Jan 2013 9:56AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi,
This is all very intriuging. Where have you found info of this person coming and going from Ireland/ England and USA and Canada also where is the information re the nothern Ireland hospital.
I have scoured newspaper passenger lists and all those online but can't find him anywhere.
I know Demont Morenzy applied for a US passport in autumn 1858.

Where did the Durham relatives live exactly. Did they have a big estate up there? What were their names?
Also, are you living in UK?
I am in Derbyshire.

On Demont's second marriage certificate it states he was born in Lincolnshire. Very puzzling.

I am eagerly awaiting the results of your research into this devious man.
My friend in Pennsylvania will be thrilled if we can pin down her
great grandfather to some family in UK.

We have found so much about him after his graduation in Philadelphia but nothing of his origins,

Cheers and thanks
Marianne Head

Re: Demont F Morenzy ships surgeon

Posted: 24 Mar 2014 1:17PM GMT
Classification: Query
I am the ancestor of Demont Morenzy in Pennsylvania that MHEAD had metioned. I was wondering if you would share the info you have with these facts or please let me know where you found the info so I may research it as well. In your info above, you should know that Mary Buggy and Sir William also had 2 daughters as well as sons William and "Haydock" They are mentioned in a court case, and Mary Buggy also had about a 30yr relationship with Sir William.

Thanks again,
S Morenzy Wagner
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