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Peder Tostensen and Ingeborg Knutsdatter/Knutsdt

Peder Tostensen and Ingeborg Knutsdatter/Knutsdt

Vicki Walberg (View posts)
Posted: 28 Jun 2002 3:13AM GMT
Classification: Query
Surnames: Tostensen and Knutsdatter
Peder Tostensen b. 14 AUG 1821, d. 25 MAR 1883
Ingeborg Knutsdt/Knutsdatter b. 2 FEB 1833, d. 29 JAN 1886. Both are listed in my Gravaas/Gravos Family Bible.
Looking for more information on both.

The Gravaas/Gravos family was from Steinkjer, Norway. Albert my g grandfather emigrated to America and married Kari P. Dale Aug. 1888 in Cresco, IA. She died in Dec. 1891 and he remarried a few years later and had a family. Second wife was Anne T. (?).

If you can help I would be most grateful.
Thanks,
Vicki Walberg
Vacaville, CA

Re: Peder Tostensen and Ingeborg Knutsdatter/Knutsdt

Heidi (View posts)
Posted: 28 Jun 2002 10:07AM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi!

I couldn`t find the couple i Steinkjer in the 1865-census for Sparbu parish, where Steinkjer was cituated.

I did find a couple at Familysearch.com by the same names and pretty close birthyears (which is pretty much all you can expect there, since the years were often calculated):

Peder Tostensen b.1822, son of Tosten Gulbrandsen, married Ingeborg Knutsdtr. b. 1833, daughter of Knud Knudsen, in Øystre (eastern) Slidre, Oppland county, 01 May 1856.

They may have moved from Oppland county to Nord-Trøndelag county and Gravaas in Sparbu parish after 1865, when this couple are at Skolte farm in Øystre Slidre parish:

http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

No Albert there, though. Do you know his birthyear, or recognize any siblings names?

This was the only couple I could find matching these names in the 1865-census, using all possible spellings for Peders lastname (thorsteins, thorstens, thorstensen, thorstes, torssteens, torsteins, torsteinsen, torstens, torstensen, torstenss, torstensøn, torstinssøn, tostens, tostensen).

Re: Peder Tostensen and Ingeborg Knutsdatter/Knutsdt

Vicki Walberg (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 12:37AM GMT
Classification: Query
Surnames: Tostensen and Knutsdatter
Heidi,

Thank you so much for your help. I believe this is probably the same couple. Dates are too close. But it is so hard to tell with norwegian ancestors. Things are so different, names are so common and there are so many with the same names sen,datter.

Thank you for finding Peders father. How would I go about finding the parents of Ingeborg. Knutsdatter could be anyone. Is there a specific way to check this out? You seem to know so much about looking them up.

Thanks again for everything. This was a big help.

Vicki

Re: More Slidre records...

Heidi (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 10:42AM GMT
Classification: Query
Well, if we assume this is them, and they were actually both born in Øystre Slidre, we`d have to check out the churchregisters for the Slidre area.

The records at LDS (Familyserach.com) go from 1848-1873, and I found seven children in that period:

1. Astrid PEDERSDATTER - Vital Records Index
Gender: F Birth/Christening: 22 Jan 1857 Ostre Slidre, Oppland, Norway

2. Tosten PEDERSEN - Vital Records Index
Gender: M Birth/Christening: 29 May 1858 Ostre Slidre, Oppland, Norway

3. Marit PEDERSDATTER - Vital Records Index
Gender: F Birth/Christening: 18 Sep 1859 Ostre Slidre, Oppland, Norway

4. Ingeborg PEDERSDATTER - Vital Records Index
Gender: F Birth/Christening: 08 Sep 1863 Ostre Slidre, Oppland, Norway

5. Kari PEDERSDATTER - Vital Records Index
Gender: F Birth/Christening: 11 Aug 1866 Ostre Slidre, Oppland, Norway

6. Knud PEDERSEN - Vital Records Index
Gender: M Birth/Christening: 16 Jan 1869 Ostre Slidre, Oppland, Norway

7. Gulbrand PEDERSEN - Vital Records Index
Gender: M Birth/Christening: 01 May 1873 Ostre Slidre, Oppland, Norway

Still no Albert... Hmmm. Does any of the above male birthdates match his (when was he born)? Maybe he took the name Albert in the States - or maybe this is a wild goose chase?!

More...

Heidi (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 11:58AM GMT
Classification: Query

Ingeborg Knudsdtr. born in Slidre was christened Feb 16th 1833 (pretty good match to birthdate, eh?), parents Knud Knudsen and Marit Jonsdtr.

The wife of Tosten Gulbrandsen b. abt 1792 was Astri Pedersdtr. b. abt. 1793. They were married 2 Nov 1816 in Øystre Slidre.

Here is the family at Mørstad farm (not far from Skolte) in 1865-census, with children Gudbrand (with family) and Anne:
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Since Gudbrand was the oldest son, he took over the farm, and Peder had to find somewhere else to crop - and went on north to Steinkjer ...? Maybe the whole family did, I couldn`t find them in Slidre in the 1900-census (maybe because Peder`s siblings were dead by then, but I couldn`t find Gudbrand`s children either).

Here is Tosten Gulbrandsen in the 1801-census at Dahle farm:
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

His father Guldbrand Tollefs. Dahle was married twice, first to Kristi Haldorsdtr. May 27th 1781, who probably died in childbirth shortly after, because on March 29th 1782 he got engaged to Marit Tostensdtr. who he married Dec. 28th 1782:
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

............

And here is Astri with her mother Kari Olsdtr. Rudi and stepfather Ole Erichsen Tilden (married May 6th 1798):
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

My guess is that her father is the Peder Olsen Rudi who dies at this farm June 16th 1795, 39 years old:
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Peder was from Haavig, Kari from Rudi. They were married Nov 27th 1783:
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

The reason you find so many -sen/-son and -datter names, is because these are the patronyms they used in old Norway (untill abt. 1900 when the tradition "broke up" - first in the towns then in the country). Pedersen indicates son of Peder, Pedersdtr./Pedersdatter indicates daughter of Peder. Instead of confusion this tends to make it easier to find the parents. Quite often the names of the children are excellent pointers too, because there was a fairly strict namingtradition. Tosten, son of Peder Knudson and Marit, would name his first son Peder and first daughter Marit, then name his wife`s children. If they took over a farm on HER side, they would name her parents first. In addition they would use the farmname - i.e. Tosten Gulbrandsen Dahle in 1801, but then Tosten Gulbrandsen Mørstad, when he moved to that farm.
So when/if this/your Peder Tostensen moved to Gravaas, he would change his farmname/lastname to Gravaas.

What we need to get our hands on are records from Gravaas / Steinkjer, we still have to "prove" that this Peder IS the same one! What does the family bible say? Anything you need translated?

Albert Andreasson Gravaas

Heidi (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 12:11PM GMT
Classification: Query
This seems to be Albert Gravaas heading for the States:

http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

And here he`s been home for a visit:

http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Here is Albert with his family in the 1865-census for Steinkjer in Sparbu parish, streetname Øvre (upper) Elvegate nr. 20:

http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Parents are Andreas Ols. Gravaas in his 47th year, born in Stod parish, and Anne Andersdtr. in her 49th year, born in Steinkjer.


I have NO CLUE what the connection between this family, and the family we have been tracking around Slidre could be. Again: What does the bible say?

More on Gravos

Heidi (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 5:51PM GMT
Classification: Query
This info is from www.Familysearch.com, LDS records, batchnumber 7605405, probably submitted info from another researcher (may not be 100% correct):

Anton chr. 26 Dec 1844
Oline Margrethe chr. 24 May 1847
Anne Bergithe chr. 25 Mar 1849
Albert chr. 2 Dec 1855
Christian Oluf chr. 26 Dec 1858
Ingeborganna chr. 26 Dec 1862

They seem to have had a daughter Olava too, born July 1853.

All christened in Skei subparish of Sparbu, Nord-Trøndelag county. Today Skei is a kommune of its own. The 1900-census has Anton born in Ongdal valley of Skei.

Parents: Anne T. Skei, (born Anne Andersdt) b.1817 in Ogndalen, Skei, died 1898. Married to Andreas Andersen Gravos, b 1819 at the Oxås farm, Egge, Stod.
Anne Andersdtr. and Andreas Andersen (1865-census says Olsen, but all these records have him as Andersen) married Apr 9th 1845.

Anne christened march 22nd 1817, daughter of Anders Olsen and Olava Olsdtr. in Skei.

This may be the parents at Brantzæg farm:
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Andreas christened 4 Jul 1819 in Egge subparish of Stod, son of Anders Michelsen Oxaas/Oxås and Malena Michelsdtr. Parents married 29 May 1808 in Egge.

Here is Anders in 1801 (his younger brother is here called Anders too, but his name was Andreas, b. 1787):
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Anders christened 28 Oct 1781 in Egge (Stod), Malena christened 26 Dec 1784 also in Egge.

Here is Malena:
http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Today Skei, Egge, Sparbu and Stod are neighbouring parishes/kommuner.

Here is his brother Anton at Øvre Elvegate 19 (they lived in number 20 in 1865), he is now a widower living with his housekeeper:

http://digitalarkivet.uib.no/cgi-win/webcens.exe?slag=visbas...

Found a homepage by Olav Øverdahl, e-mail to try olavov@ringnett.no
which has Olava Andreasdtr. Gravos (Alberts sister) married 1882 to Lars Martin Haagensen Warnes (1855-1943) born in Stjørdal, they had a daughter Anna Birgitte Warnes (sep 1882 - des 1954). She married Peder Eliot Olsen (jan 1882 - mai 1970), feb 1905 in Minneapolis.
They had a son: Erling Asbjørn Olsen (March 1913-Feb 1972), he married Gudrun Johanne Bye b. 1912, in May 1937 in Trondheim.
They had three daughters in Trondheim: Brit Johanne b. 1937 (married Leo Anderson Israelsen in 1962 - live in Cache, UT), Randi b. 1942 (married Jay Lars Hansen in 1969) and Elin b. 1949 (married Odd Viktil in 1969).

Brit J. and Leo had these children:
Andrew Leo Israelsen b. 1963, married Yvonne Greenwood in 1988
Derek Olsen Israelsen b. 1968, married Mindi Traeden in 1998
Brent Michael Israelsen b. 1970, married Sara Wiberg in 1994
Einar Leroy Israelsen b. 1972
Teresa Marie Israelsen b. 1975

Here is the link to Olav Øverdahl`s page: http://home.ringnett.no/olavov/Starte.htm

Good luck!

Re: More...

Vicki Walberg (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 6:45PM GMT
Classification: Query
Surnames: Andreason, Andersen, Gravaas, Mikkelsen, Olsen, Olsdatter, Andersdatter, Gresli
Heidi,

I cannot believe the information you can come up with. It is absolutely remarkable? The information you found on Albert took me a very long time to discover. I am going to give you all the information so that you can better understand what the bible says and then perhaps with your knowledge you can give me some pointers or steer me in the right direction.

I started this quest to try to discover who my great grandmother is. I have first names only on the two women that Albert (my great grandfather) married. I am not sure anymore which one is my g grandmother, and I cannot check them out as I do not have verification of their last name or who there families were.

Albert Gravaas (changed to Gravos, after he was in the U.S) was born 06 SEP 1855 in Gravaas, Skei, Steinkjer, N-Trondelag, Norway. Parent: Andreas Andersen Gravaas/Gravos and mother was Anne Andersdt.

Andreas Anderson Gravos b. 17 MAY 1819, Oxaas, Egge, Stod. His parents were: Anders Michelsen and Malena Michelsdt. (this to me is confusing. How could they both have the same last name or is it a mistake listed in the information I have) Malena was from Saursaunet, Egge and Anders was from Oxaas, Egge.

Andreas Anderson Gravos married Anne Andersdt in Skei, but she was from Ogndalen. They married 09 APR 1845.
Children:
Anton Thomas b. 1844
Oline Margrethe b. 1847 m. Nekolai Ramstad
Anna Birgithe b. 1849 m. Anton Aasen
Ole b. 1851 m. Jensine Marie Hansdt
Olava b. 1853 m. Lars Martin Warnes (Haagensen)
Albert b. 1855 m. Kari P.Dale/Dahl(?) and Anne T. (?)
Cristian Olaf b. 1858
Ingeborganna b. 1862 m. Wikkelsmo (later change to Moe)

As far as I know only Ingeborganna and Albert came to the US. To the Minnesota/Iowa area.

Albert immigrated to the US. He married Kari P. Dale 16 AUG 1888 in Cresco Iowa. I have a paper in the bible that lists the date and town and I think it says witnesses. It is in Norwegian...but the names and dates are understandable.
Kari died a couple of years later and Albert went back to Steinkjer, to visit or remarry? Then returned to the US. It was said that he married Anne T. (?) around 1893 as the first child is listed as Anna Marie Gravaas born in 1894. Whether he married Anne when he returned to Norway or in the US I do not know. The story passed down is that the first wife and the second were related. But do not know for sure. One of them was from a town very close to where Albert grew up.

I do not know who Kari's parents were, or Anne's parents either. Often wondered if the middle initial could be the first initial of their maiden names. What do you think?

I found Albert and Anne on the 1900 Cresco Iowa Census, but on the 1910 Cresco Iowa Census only Albert and children are listed. Albert moved his family (around 1920) to the Willamette Valley and homesteaded in Vida, Lane Co., Oregon. He and most of his children lived and are buried in the same general area. When Albert where Anne were married is a mystery. Where she died and is buried is a mystery, who her family was is a mystery. I can find nothing to help with this information. No obit or death certificate. So I am at a loss how to trace my ancestry with that info.

From the bible pages it lists these names and dates:
Fodsler: (born?)
Andreas Gravaas 18 May 1819
Ane Gravaas 11 Jan 1817
Peder Tostensen 14 Aug 1821
Ingeborg Knutsdatter 02 Feb 1833
Albert Gravaas 06 Sep 1855
Kari Gravaas 10 Aug 1866 (last name Dale)
Anton Gravaas 27 Jul 1845
Oline Ramstad 29 Feb 1847 (Gravaas)
Anna Aasen 25 Jan 1849 (Gravaas)
Ole Gravaas 15 Mar 1851
Olava Varnes Warnes? 17 Jun 1853 (Gravaas)
Christian Gravaas 12 Sep 1858
Ingeborg Wikkelsmo 02 Nov. 1862 (Gravaas)

Dodsfald (Death?)
Andreas Gravaas 30 Sep 1892
Ane Gravaas 29 Jun 1889
Peder Tostensen 25 Mar 1883
Ingeborg Knutsdatter 29 Jan 1886
Kari Gravaas 27 Dec 1891 (Dale)
Anne T. Gravaas 02 Jan 1908 (2nd wife of Albert)
Anton Gravaas 15 Jul 1914
Ole Gravaas 05 Jan 1921
Oline Ramstad 24 Feb 1926 (Gravaas)
Anna Aasen 05 Jul1927 (Gravaas)
Albert Gravaas 09 Feb 1929

This is the most beautiful bible...very heavy, about 5 inches thick, 9x12 in size, all in Norwegian except for names and dates. Cover is carved in wood with leather stretched over it and gold leaf type lettering.

The Marriage record says: Your help please:
Dette Bevidner
Alberg Gravaas of Cresco Iowa
Kari P. or "D" Dale of Cresco Iowa
Aegteskabets Hellige Baand
Cresco Iowa den Sgttende dag i August i vor heeres uar 1888.
I Ncerverelie or Naevaerelfe af: H. C. Hjerleid, R. Borgstad or Bogstad
Underifrift
T. H. Eggen
Ev. Luth. Pastor
Can you help me with the translation?

That is all I know. I would be so very thankful and greatful if you could give me some ideas on how to try to discover who Kari or Anne's families were....any help at all would be most appreciated.

Thank you so much for your time and your help already.

Vicki Walberg
Vacaville, CA




Re: More...Forgot

Vicki Walberg (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 6:56PM GMT
Classification: Query
Surnames: Andreason, Andersen, Gravaas, Mikkelsen, Olsen, Olsdatter, Andersdatter, Gresli
I do not think you got my other message. I was looking for anything to do with my ancestry and found your messages on Knutsdatter and Tostensen, so I took a chance. I was hoping that the "T" for Tostensen may perhaps shed some light. Perhaps the "T" in Tostensen stands for the middle initial in my g grandmothers name Anne "T" Gravaas.

There are also some pictures in the back of the book. They are wonderful pictures from the late 1800's. There is one marked Anne T. Gravaas, a young women with four older women. I would give anything to know who those people are.

Is this all impossible....a goose chase as you mentioned?

Thanks,
Vicki

There`s the link!

Heidi (View posts)
Posted: 29 Jun 2002 10:02PM GMT
Classification: Query
So there we have it!

Kari P. Dale:
Tosten Gulbrandsen, Peders father, is born at Dahle. And did you notice the birthdate I posted for Peder`s daughter Kari? The excact same as in the bible!

Ta-da!
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