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Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Kathleen Bretton (View posts)
Posted: 3 Oct 2003 8:12PM GMT
Classification: Query
I am looking for my grandfather's birthplace in Germany. From a family member, I am told he was born in Byron, a town 50 miles southwest of Munich. Every town name I find that is close to "Byron" is definately not 50 miles southwest of Munich. But, as he was born 8/11/1868, my data is second or third hand.

Every census and his naturalization records (at least the index at http://www.rootsweb.com/~ohcuyah2/nats/coarch/part3/pg0147.h...) show only "Germany" as his place of birth.

Also, if anyone has any info about the family, here are the details:
John A./Arthur John Long/Lang(?) was born in Germany on August 11, 1868. His parents died while he was young and was taken in by a harsh uncle. In 1885, he left Germany for America, winding up in Cleveland, Ohio where he was greatly helped by Max Raeder.
In the early 1890's he married Adelaine/Ada Raeder and they had Edna [Paul Grodetz](1894-1955) , Elmer [Jesse](1897-1990), Clarence [Cora](1900-1963), and Kenneth [Lorraine](1905-1963). Adelaine died and, later, Arthur (as he was going by then) married Ada (yes, the same name!) Rupprecht (daughter of Paul and Augusta Jaekel Rupprecht) in Chicago. They had Donald ([Virginia](1922-1964 and Roger [Elizabeth](1926-2001).

We know Arthur hung awnings in Cleveland. Also, he and his eldest sons and son-in-law started Long Plumbing and Supply in Chicago (which closed in 1993). Other than a couple of addresses, that is about all we know about him. We have no idea who his parents in Germany were. Even his death certificate lists them as "unknown". (I'm sure he knew who they were, but his death certificate was filled out by his son who apparently did not.)

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Robert T. (View posts)
Posted: 4 Oct 2003 12:45AM GMT
Classification: Query
Kathleen, nothing comes to mind off-hand, but I'll give this some thought (taking into account both distance from and direction from Munich) as I spent quite a number of years of my own life in Munich. But one question comes to mind:

"Bavaria" in German is "Bayern". Could it be that your family member is actually thinking of this rather than of the name of the town?

One other thing if you're trying to find out the names of John Arthur's parents and his exact place of birth: I am assuming that John Arthur and Ada Raeder were married in Cleveland, and I checked the entry in the 1900 census, and the 1900 census indicates that they were married 8 years when the census was taken, meaning that they were married either in 1891 or 1892, depending on whether or not their anniversary had already taken place when the census was taken in June 1900. Do you know what church in Cleveland they got married in? If so, I would suggest that you contact the church and ask either for a copy of or for a complete transcript of their full marriage record. I would think that the marriage record would include names of parents and possibly exact place of birth. The same would hold true for the Chicago marriage record of John Arthur and Ada Rupprecht, if you know when they were married and what church in Chicago they got married in.

Robert

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Kathleen Bretton (View posts)
Posted: 4 Oct 2003 1:36AM GMT
Classification: Query
Thanks!

I suppose that is possible. As John/Arthur (He changed his name; you'll find him as Arthur in the 1920 and 1930 census. If you find him in the 1910 census, I'd be tickled.) died in 1942, most of those alive today to give information were very young when he was alive. My own father (the youngest) was only five when John/Arthur died. I started this research barely knowing his name and his middle name was even given to us incorrectly by our father. Finding that he originally went by John in this country, that he immigrated first to Cleveland and that his first wife was Ada Raeder are all HUGE success stories for us! Recently finding a living relative who knew the story of his being orphaned young was also big news. But, even this child of John/Arthur's oldest didn't have much information to share.

I have ordered the official marriage certificate from Cleveland and am hoping it will have some information. (I also have his naturalization papers en route.) Given the family, I am certain the ceremony would have been religious, but the actual church would be a guess. Any ideas on how to narrow the search? I'm hoping the certificate will indicate a pastor and/or church.

Getting his second marriage record is a great challenge. We think we know the year, but there is no index for the 60,000 marriages in Chicago that year. I'm not yet ready to plow through them individually. And, the number of churches is also vastly greater than Cleveland. :(

We've also looked for him in Germans To America since it would seem his exact date of arrival in the U.S. is indicated on his naturalization records. No luck there. :(

Most of our lines go back at least a couple generations, but this one is our closest "brick wall".

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Robert T. (View posts)
Posted: 4 Oct 2003 3:20AM GMT
Classification: Query
Kathleen, one quick question: What religious denomination were John Arthur and his wives?

Robert

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Posted: 4 Oct 2003 11:16PM GMT
Classification: Query
The word Byron is not German Probably the German state Bayern which sounds close to that was meant. Munich is the capital of Bayern

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Kathleen Bretton (View posts)
Posted: 5 Oct 2003 1:08AM GMT
Classification: Query
We do not know for certain. My best guess is Lutheran. But, that is only because Ada Rupprecht (wife #2) came from a very Lutheran family. Her mother's family is all buried in a Lutheran cemetery and her father's family is full of Lutheran pastors. Her father went to Lutheran divinity school at least briefly, although it seems he never actualy joined the clergy. Serveral of his brothers went down the divinity route and their father was a Lutheran pastor for over 50 years. So, a good guess is that, although Ada was raised by her mother's family after her mother died when she was little, she was raised Lutheran. But, my father remembered her being involved in another church that was not Lutheran. But, that may have only been after her widowhood.

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Robert T. (View posts)
Posted: 5 Oct 2003 2:11AM GMT
Classification: Query
Kathleen, religious denomination is important because in Germany you have your Catholic areas and your Protestant areas. It would be highly unlikely for a person who came from a town 50 miles southwest of Munich not to be Catholic. That area is as Catholic as Catholic can be. So if you really think John Arthur was Lutheran, then I think you can forget the 50 miles southwest of Munich. You'll have to look for his hometown elsewhere.

Robert

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Linda (View posts)
Posted: 6 Aug 2005 5:52PM GMT
Classification: Query
We are also looking for family born in Germany(Berlin). Paul Grodetz is a family name in our past and we know he was married to Edna(1894). If you come up with any information on Stephan, Bruno or Gregory Grodetz we would appreciate it. We know they were from the Berlin area and came to the United States in or about 1907?????? Hope you have lots of luck with your search.

Linda and Sharon

Re: Byron, Germany in Bavaria? (John A./Arthur J. Long)

Posted: 7 Aug 2005 1:49AM GMT
Classification: Query
Are those brothers of Paul Grodetz?

Do you have any family pictures?
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