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Margaret Williams DOB abt 1853 Wales. DOD 1902 Liverpool

Margaret Williams DOB abt 1853 Wales. DOD 1902 Liverpool

Posted: 13 May 2014 12:17PM GMT
Classification: Query
Hi
I am looking for the family of my Great Grandmother Margaret Williams born about 1853 and died Liverpool aged 49 in 1902 (Death Index). To date I have not found any records that can confirm I am on the right track. I have no information handed down through the family lore but I do have a very blurry picture of her. I would be very grateful if someone can point me in the right direction

According to a Wedding Announcement in the Liverpool Mercury She was the youngest Daughter of Robert Williams from The Count, near Oswestry,

Margaret married John Heatley in 1877 in Liverpool, the marriage banns give no clue to her family except her father was a laborer

The 1881 Census gives her DOB as 1853 place of birth Oswestyy
The 1891 Census gives her DOB as 1855 place of birth Shropshire
The 1901 Census gives her DOB as 1853 place of birth Cevon Cianol, Denbighshire (note the writing is not very clear so the spelling could be incorrect)

I have looked on google and googlemaps for both The Count and Cevon Cianol but neither has given me any tangible information

Thanks in advance

Matthew

Re: Margaret Williams DOB abt 1853 Wales. DOD 1902 Liverpool

Posted: 13 May 2014 5:41PM GMT
Classification: Query
Cevon Cianol is probably an Anglicisation of Cefn Canol. There is such a place not far from oswestry but it is on the Wales side of the border.

Re: Margaret Williams DOB abt 1853 Wales. DOD 1902 Liverpool

Posted: 13 May 2014 5:53PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 13 May 2014 6:29PM GMT
"Cevon Cianol" = Cefn Canol, a village that sits directly on the Wales/England border, just to the west of Oswestry

"The Count" is probably Llawnt, near Cefn Canol

On the 1871 census Margaret is living with her parents, Robert and Margaret Williams, and her sister Mary, at Cefn Canol.
Her parents are still there on the 1881 census but Margaret has moved out.

All of the censuses are for Cefn Canol, Shropshire, England. So the family obviously lived on the English side of the border.

Re: Margaret Williams DOB abt 1853 Wales. DOD 1902 Liverpool

Posted: 14 May 2014 10:26AM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 14 May 2014 10:27AM GMT
Thank you both for your help and advice and it does seem like Cefn Canol is the place where she came from.. I do have a couple of questions
a) Does Llawnt mean Count in Welsh?
b) Would you giving me a bit of advice as to what were the parameters that you searched with to find her in the Census. I have looked and looked and have been unable to find the census concerned

The only other clue I have is from what my Mother once said that she came from Ruabon (which according to googlemaps) isn't too far from Cefn Canol

Below is the only picture of Margaret that we have

Once again thank you for your help it is very much appreciated

Cheers

Matthew

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Re: Margaret Williams DOB abt 1853 Wales. DOD 1902 Liverpool

Posted: 14 May 2014 11:56AM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 14 May 2014 11:58AM GMT
I think you can forget "The Court"? This is highly lightly to be a bad transcription of "Y Llawnt" or "The Llawnt". In modern Welsh it should probably be written "Y Lawnt", with only one 'L', and there are lots of references to "Y Lawnt" throughout Wales today.

I think the most obvious translation would be "lawn" or "smooth hill" but place names can often be derived from not-so-obvious sources!

If you belive that Margaret came from Ruabon I would be worried! I wouldn't say that Ruabon was "close" to Llansilin though? Also, it would not fit in with any of the census data that you originally gave.

However, the village of Cefn, in the south of the old Ruabon parish on the banks of the River Dee, does include the districts of Cefn Mawr and Cefn Bychan, but I've not come across a Cefn Canol here?
("Cefn" = "Ridge"; "Mawr" = "Big"; "Bychan" = "Small"; "Canol" = "Middle")

I found the family at Cefn Canol in the censuses by searching for a "Robert Williams"; born "1823"; living in "Llansilin"

Re: Margaret Williams DOB abt 1853 Wales. DOD 1902 Liverpool

Posted: 15 May 2014 2:48AM GMT
Classification: Query
I think I will ignore the comment from my Mother and go with the facts I have to date and thats from the Censuses.

I don't mean to sound to much of an amateur but I can not find the censuses you have so kindly located. I have searched and searched looked under the parameters of
Robert Williams Born 1823
(included then excluded Wife Margaret Child Mary and Margaret
living in Llansilin then cefn canol,

but I can not seem to find anything under either the English nor Wales Censuses 1871 nor 1881

Consequently I would be grateful if you could spell it out to me so I can see what you have found or send me a link or something

Thanks very much

Matthew
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