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A few stumpers

A few stumpers

Posted: 16 Mar 2013 4:27PM GMT
Classification: Query
My great greandmother Catherine Casey was born in Bayonne NJ in either 1900 or 1901. I traced her family back to the 1900 cencus but on that cencus she was not on it. There was another name, Kate born May 1900, which I initially assumed was Catherine. However, I found in the NJ birth index that "Kate" died at one year old.

Sould i infer that Kate and Catherine are two different people or that I have the wrong family? And if it is her family, how would I find her birthdate to get a cerificate to be sure?

Also, where do i find Naturalization records for people in NY and NJ that are not online that according to cencus'were either naturalized or got first papers?

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 16 Mar 2013 5:21PM GMT
Classification: Query
Take a step forward to the 1910 Census, do you think you have the correct family in that census? Is there enough (relatively) same data, (ie, parents and siblings) in the 1910 Census to qualify you have the same family in the 1900?

>> Sould i infer that Kate and Catherine are two different people or that I have the wrong family? And if it is her family, how would I find her birthdate to get a cerificate to be sure? <<

The official enumeration day of the 1900 census was 1 June 1900.

>>There was another name, Kate born May 1900, which I initially assumed was Catherine. However, I found in the NJ birth index that "Kate" died at one year old. <<

The math says the Kate, b May 1900 and died at one year old, and was in the 1900 Census, is not the Catherine born later (abt 1901). It was not unusual for a subsequent born child to be given the same name as a deceased sibling.

If you want to post the two census records, 1900 and 1910 for an opinion as to whether they're the same household, that would help.

>>Also, where do i find Naturalization records for people in NY and NJ that are not online that according to cencus'were either naturalized or got first papers?<<

fold3.com (a fee subscription site)has some of this data on-line. If you want to post the names, I'll have a look.

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 16 Mar 2013 8:51PM GMT
Classification: Query
Kate is a nickname for Catherine. But as previously noted you need to compare other information as well.

Joan

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 16 Mar 2013 9:49PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 17 Mar 2013 1:26AM GMT
I'm quite sure I have the right family. My GGrandfather lived with them after he married Catherine so thats how I traced from the 1930 census.
1920
http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=1920usfedcen&a...
1910
http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=1910uscenindex...
1900
http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=1900usfedcen&a...

And Daciodan I appriciate that offer so much. Unfortunatly Im at that point where my search in taking me overseas. I have a few names and you could even help me with one that would be amazing.

Luis Francis Bethencourt B. 1901 Curacao DWI. Naturalized sometime beween 1925 and 1962. NY
Wife: Florence Children: Anna, Robert, Luise


James Sullivan B.Ireland abt 1874 naturalized around 1908
wife Margaret(maggie) CHildren: Anna, James, John, Leo NJ

Thomas John Keane B.Ireland abt 1869 Naturalized around 1889
Wife Rose Children: Lester, FLorence, Viola NY

Phillip Colling B. Lux or Germany B. 1881 Naturalized 1918
Wife Marie Stepson Nicholas Mertens NY

Marie Colling/Mertens B abt 1875 Lux or Germany Naturalized 1918 Husband Phillip Colling Son: Nicholas Mertens NY

Nicholas Joseph Mertens B 1898 Lux or Germany Naturalized by 1930, 1st papers by 1918 NY

John Murphy B. Abt 1870 Wales. Naturalized 189? in either NY or Mass
Wife: Mary Children: Eileen, Lillian, Eva or none depending on the exact year.

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 17 Mar 2013 10:56PM GMT
Classification: Query
The census data looks solid to me.

Have you checked the Naturalization Index databases on Ancestry or familysearch.org?

If you can narrow down more specific dates and places (county and State), then I'll have a look for the applications on fold3. Please note fold3's collection is limited in scope, Massachusetts and New York are included, but even those are not 100% digitized yet. No New Jersey.

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 19 Mar 2013 6:53PM GMT
Classification: Query
I did look but as ive only been doing this for about a year I could have missed something. i do go back periodically to check though.

John Murphy 1880-1898 Boston MA. 1900 Harlem, Manhattan 1915-Death Brooklyn NY

Marie Mertens/Colling Pillip Colling 1910 Manhattan 1915-20 Bronx 1930-Death Englewood NJ

Nicholas Mertens 1915-1930 Bronx. 1940-1980s Yonkers Westchester NY. 1980s-Death San Fransico CA

Luis Bethencourt 1920- Rutherford NJ 1925-Hamilton Heights Manhattan. 1935-Death Westchester NY

James Sullivan 1900-Death Bayonne, Hudson, NJ

Thomas Keane- 1900-1925 Harlem, Manhattan 1930 unknown Harlem or Yonkers, Westchester, NY possible. ?-Death, Westchester.

If the data is not online where would I go to get copies of the originals? Is that possible?

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 19 Mar 2013 7:09PM GMT
Classification: Query
Edited: 19 Mar 2013 7:10PM GMT
>>If the data is not online where would I go to get copies of the originals? Is that possible?<<

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b...

There are clues in Census records about when the individual immigrated, and what their naturalization status was at the time of the enumeration. Check the individuals in 1900, 1910 census for this data.

There are several db's on Ancestry to check, here is the link to U.S. Naturalization Records Indexes, 1794-1995, : http://search.ancestry.com/search/db.aspx?dbid=1192, the others are listed on the right side.

You'll want to search these db's individually.

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 19 Mar 2013 8:29PM GMT
Classification: Query
Thanks! Do you know if records before 1900 still exist anywhere that I can order? The gov site only goes back to 1906. Thomas Keane, according to the 1920 census was naturalized around 1889. But i'll keep trying on ancestry.

Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 19 Mar 2013 10:42PM GMT
Classification: Query
You need to have a very well defined idea of when and where the person filed the application.

The records can be kept on a county level, in a state historical archive, at a district level, those are some of the choices.

You start with the State the person filed in, to see how they handled those archived records. You might be surprised what you can turn up by googling.

>>Thomas Keane, according to the 1920 census was naturalized around 1889.<<

What do the 1900 & 1910 Census have? Is the data consistent?





Re: A few stumpers

Posted: 19 Mar 2013 11:24PM GMT
Classification: Query
The 1910 census says he was naturalized as did the 1915 NY census. His birth and arrival year is all roughly within 3-5 years. Unfortuatly in the 1900 census the section for citizenship was left blank.
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