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Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 12 Nov 2012 11:22PM GMT
Classification: Query
What would be a good way within FTM2012 to properly document a change in place name? For example, I have ancestors that lived in Marienthal, Russia and that location is now known as Marienka, Ukraine.

What recommendations would you have to properly document this, so that the location will show up properly in "Places" but still preserve the historical name reference? Thanks!!

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 13 Nov 2012 12:47PM GMT
Classification: Query
Unfortunately, FTM does not handle historical place names as well as some other applications do. Others may have ideas for better ways to do this but here's how I handle them:

1. In Places view, find the current location by selecting it from the list on the left side.
2. Make certain FTM indicates the current location is resolved. If not, resolve it.
3. Over on the right, copy the GPS/Latitude Longitude data which is in the Location field.
4. Back on the left side, select the historical location.
5. On the right side, paste the GPS/Latitude Longitude data (of the current location) into the Location field of the historical location.
6. Back to the left side, right click on the historical location and select "Ignore Place Warning".

FTM will then indicate the historical location is resolved and it will show up on the map in the same spot as the current location.

I wish FTM at least had the ability to add a note to a location, or somehow tag it with from/to dates, so that there would be a way to clearly indicate the dates of a historical location's existence.

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 13 Nov 2012 3:46PM GMT
Classification: Query
Ad4hc process

My Comment – Quite Clever

A few questions

Q1 - Your step 1 – What if the current location does not exist in the list on the left? What do you do? Do you create a “dummy” current location and then resolve it?

Q2 - Assume a current location does exist on the left and it contains various fact names [e.g. contains a “birth” fact name] but it does not contain the fact name that you have in your historical location [e.g. does not contain the fact name “death” which you have in your historical location]. What do you do? And what is the result?

Q3 – Your statement, “FTM will then indicate the historical location is resolved” How can you tell it has been resolved and/or what evidence do you see that shows the historical location has been resolved?

Q4 – Your statement, “and it will show up on the map in the same spot as the current location. Do both sets of data [historical and current] also show up on the right hand window pane?

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 13 Nov 2012 3:52PM GMT
Classification: Query
This question comes up a lot, and there is no good answer. FTM is not explicitly designed to handle historical locations, so the best advice you'll get here is how people work around this shortcoming in the program.

(As far as I know, at this time none of the other major genealogical programs relate historical locations to modern ones.)

As far as I gather from previous discussions, there are three methods most widely used:

1) Historical place names are used in the place field and the errors from the Place Name Authority (PNA) are ignored; some people go to the extra length of setting the GPS coordinates on the map in the Places workspace, but this data doesn't export and won't even appear in a report, so it's only good for your map screen (it also doesn't translate to the map at ancestry.com for linked trees). People who use this method usually make note of the modern location either in the description (not exportable via GEDCOM) or in the fact notes (exportable, but not visible at ancestry.com for linked trees) or they put it in both. This method is probably the one preferred by the more serious genealogists, because it's true to the data.

2) Modern locations are always used in the place field and note is made of the historical location in the description, notes, or both. This method is probably most compatible with the way FTM and Ancestry.com are set up.

3) Each fact is duplicated so that there are two instances of the place field. In one the modern place is inserted; in the other, the historical.

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 13 Nov 2012 4:02PM GMT
Classification: Query
Great suggestions! Thank you both!!

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 13 Nov 2012 4:31PM GMT
Classification: Query
I would flag the old one as "Ignore Place Setting" and add a statement in the note what today's location name is.
Some of these locations may even still change again.

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 13 Nov 2012 6:45PM GMT
Classification: Query
KATHYMARIEANN, to answer your questions...

Q1 - If the current location does not exist on the left in Places view, you'll have to first add a fact to someone over in the People view. I know of no way to add a place independently, i.e. without being somehow attached to an individual.

Q2 - If I'm understanding your question correctly, the facts you see over on the right are only the ones linked to the location you've selected over on the left. So any facts linked to your current location will be independent of facts linked to your historical location.

For lack of any way to notate these differences in Places view, I use the Description field of the facts. For example, a person was born in Wagram, Richmond County, NC in 1888. That area became Scotland County in 1899. And say they died in 1901. In the birth fact, I'll enter (without quotes) "became Scotland County in 1899" in the Description field. Then in the Death fact I'll enter "prior to 1899 was Richmond County". Those notations also help me know which county the actual records will be located at, since the records themselves typically remain in the original county.

If a fact does not already contain a Description field, go to Edit, Manage Facts, select the fact name, then click the Properties button. Select the Date/Place/Description option. While you're in that window, you can see the formatting down at the bottom for how the fact's information will appear in reports. Using my example above, a report would show the birth location as something similar to "... 1888 in Wagram, Richmond County, North Carolina (became Scotland County in 1899) ..." and the death location as something similar to "... 1901 in Wagram, Scotland County, North Carolina (prior to 1899 was Richmond County) ..."

Q3 - You can tell whether a place is unresolved vs. resolved by the icons over on the left. An unresolved place will have a question mark on the right side of the icon. A resolved place will have a checkmark there instead. The differences are really hard to see with the change in icons during the last update.

Q4 - Only the spot marked on the map itself stays the same when you select the historical vs. current location. The facts are independent for each location. Select the historical location on the left and all you will see on the right are the facts that use the historical location. And vice versa.

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 13 Nov 2012 7:26PM GMT
Classification: Query
ad4hc

Thank you for your answers

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 15 Nov 2012 3:59PM GMT
Classification: Query
OK, so am I understanding that I will need to go into each individual place fact, under each person, to enter alternate place names in the description? Because I don't see a "description" field in the Places list.

YUCK!!

Re: Alternate Place Names - Proper Documentation

Posted: 15 Nov 2012 4:26PM GMT
Classification: Query
It is easier to use current place name for everything. In that way you will know where to go today to find more information. In the case you mentioned you would need a ticket to the Marienka Ukraine, not Marienthal Russia to search for information in your family's home town.

One of my favorite research sources is maps. Most maps are based on current names.

I would explain in a note the history of the location.
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